snopes.com Post new topic  Post a reply
search | faq | forum home

  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» Hello snopes.com » Non-UL Chat » Crash and Burn » Small Plane Hits Building in NY (Page 1)

 - UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!   This topic comprises 2 pages: 1  2   
Author Topic: Small Plane Hits Building in NY
Horse Chestnut
Happy Holly Days


Icon 1 posted      Profile for Horse Chestnut     Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
CNN is covering it now, saying a small "multi-engine" plane has hit a 20 story apartment building. Not seeing anything online yet.
Posts: 1651 | From: Columbus, Ohio | Registered: Aug 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
WonkoTheSane
Happy Holly Days


Icon 1 posted      Profile for WonkoTheSane     Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
Story

Wonko

--------------------
"It seemed to me that any civilization that had so far lost its head as to need to include detailed instructions for use in a package of toothpicks, was no longer a civilzation in which I could live and stay sane."

Posts: 1462 | From: Outside the Asylum (Massachusetts) | Registered: Jul 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Brad from Georgia
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


Icon 1 posted      Profile for Brad from Georgia   Author's Homepage   E-mail Brad from Georgia   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
It's on the main CNN page now. ETA: The address is right across the street from my agent's office! I just called him, and they're all OK--he says it was one of the helicopters that routinely cross the East River, and it somehow lost control and smashed into the neighboring building.

ETA--I was kind of rattled. My agent's OFFICE is on East 74th--his apartment is on East 71st, across from the crash site. Still rattled--I typed "editor" this time instead of "agent." Geez, I gotta wind down a little.

--------------------
"No hard feelin's and HOPpy New Year!"--Walt Kelly
Hear what you're missing: ARTC podcasts! http://artcpodcast.org/

Posts: 7581 | From: Gainesville, Georgia | Registered: Jun 2000  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
guruwan2b
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


Icon 1 posted      Profile for guruwan2b   Author's Homepage   E-mail guruwan2b   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
I was just emailing a friend to see if he is close to the crash.
Glad to hear your agent is OK, Brad.

Looks like a simple accident. Hope no one was at home in the apartment building.
Kim

--------------------
Too much of this navel gazing and we'll disappear up our own arses.
Danvers Carew

Posts: 7465 | From: Oklahoma | Registered: Oct 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Canuckistan
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


Icon 102 posted      Profile for Canuckistan   E-mail Canuckistan   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
The building hit, according to info in the New York Times article.

The New York Times article.

Posts: 8429 | From: New York run by the Swiss (Toronto) | Registered: Mar 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
guruwan2b
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


Icon 1 posted      Profile for guruwan2b   Author's Homepage   E-mail guruwan2b   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
Fighter aircraft are being put in the air over several U.S. cities as a precautionary measure, NORAD tells CNN.

--------------------
Too much of this navel gazing and we'll disappear up our own arses.
Danvers Carew

Posts: 7465 | From: Oklahoma | Registered: Oct 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Brad from Georgia
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


Icon 1 posted      Profile for Brad from Georgia   Author's Homepage   E-mail Brad from Georgia   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
Now they're saying it was definitely a small fixed-wing aircraft, not a helicopter as my agent thought it was.

--------------------
"No hard feelin's and HOPpy New Year!"--Walt Kelly
Hear what you're missing: ARTC podcasts! http://artcpodcast.org/

Posts: 7581 | From: Gainesville, Georgia | Registered: Jun 2000  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
black roses 19
Xboxing Day


Icon 1 posted      Profile for black roses 19   E-mail black roses 19   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
One confirmed fatality, according to CNN and the New York City Fire Department.

ETA: CNN just announced that there ARE two fatalities. They must be a little slower in getting information.

--------------------
"I find them to be in contradiction of the basic principles of YOUR MOM!!!" -We've Got Mail

Posts: 1361 | From: Muncie, IN | Registered: Sep 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
tribrats
Markdown, the Herald Angels Sing


Icon 1 posted      Profile for tribrats   Author's Homepage   E-mail tribrats   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
AP is saying 2.

--------------------
Snopes is moving! Here's snopes' announcement.
Come here to re-register!

Posts: 2448 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Sep 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Finite Fourier Alchemy
Markdown, the Herald Angels Sing


Icon 1 posted      Profile for Finite Fourier Alchemy   E-mail Finite Fourier Alchemy   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
From this article

quote:
The Federal Aviation Administration described the plane as a "general aviation" fixed-wing aircraft flying under visual flight rules, meaning a pilot was flying by visual landmarks.
How did they determine this? This would be the only situation where the pilot would not have had to file a flight plan, but I'm not sure how that helps anything since it seems like it would take a while to figure out who in the area filled out a flight plan and didn't close it.

Even then it seems weird. "Well yeah, anyone who would fly a plane into a building is clearly following FAR part 91. So the guy must be flying VFR."

Just seems weird, is all.

--------------------
Thinking about New England / missing old Japan

Posts: 2603 | From: Virginia | Registered: Mar 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Canuckistan
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


Icon 16 posted      Profile for Canuckistan   E-mail Canuckistan   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
CNN reporting that Yankees pitcher Cory Lidle was the pilot of the plane. His passport was apparently found on the street below the crash site.

--------------------
People need to stop appropriating Jesus as their reason for behaving badly. It's so irritating. (Avril)

Posts: 8429 | From: New York run by the Swiss (Toronto) | Registered: Mar 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
BoKu
Happy Xmas (Warranty Is Over)


Icon 1 posted      Profile for BoKu   Author's Homepage   E-mail BoKu   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Finite Fourier Alchemy:
..."Well yeah, anyone who would fly a plane into a building is clearly following FAR part 91..."

Except maybe 91.119, of course...
Posts: 2079 | From: California | Registered: Feb 2000  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Beckalina
I Am Curious, Yellowtail


Icon 1 posted      Profile for Beckalina     Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Canuckistan:
CNN reporting that Yankees pitcher Cory Lidle was the pilot of the plane. His passport was apparently found on the street below the crash site.

ESPN is also reporting that. And AP is now reporting four deaths.

I was trying to figure why they were breaking in on ESPN (they've been making us have it on at work lately too show off HD) to report on the story, then I saw the banner announcing that a Yankees pitcher had been piloting the plane.

--------------------
Look Lois, the two symbols of the Republican Party: an elephant, and a big fat white guy who is threatened by change.

Posts: 41 | From: West Central Ohio (Wee. Farms.) | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Delta-V
Xboxing Day


Icon 1 posted      Profile for Delta-V     Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Finite Fourier Alchemy:
How did they determine this? This would be the only situation where the pilot would not have had to file a flight plan, but I'm not sure how that helps anything since it seems like it would take a while to figure out who in the area filled out a flight plan and didn't close it.

I'd guess NYC is mostly all controlled airspace, in which case whatever ATC was in charge of that area should have noted an aircraft squaking 1200 had disappeared off their radar. Or he may have been still under ATC control.

--------------------
"My neighbor asked why anyone would need a car that can go 190 mph. If the answer isn't obvious, and explaination won't help." - Csabe Csere

Posts: 1225 | From: Wichita, Kansas | Registered: Nov 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
TallGeekyGirl
O Read, O Read, The Manual


Icon 1 posted      Profile for TallGeekyGirl   Author's Homepage   E-mail TallGeekyGirl   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
My heart goes out to the families of those killed in this tragic accident, but I shamefully have to admit a little relief as well.

Today is October 11th, one month exactly after September 11th. The coicidence is frightening.

--------------------
See, if I tell you about it, it won't be a mystery. It'll just be a fact, an ugly, moist fact, squatting on your brain like an octopus. And you don't want an octopus squatting on your brain, do you, son? -- Stan Smith, American Dad

Posts: 980 | From: Virginia | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Barns & No Bull
It Came Upon a Midnight Clearance


Icon 1 posted      Profile for Barns & No Bull     Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
Yeah, I thought Manhatten was controlled airspace... then I hear that small crafts commonly fly right past where this happened. I assumed that that stuff wasn't supposed to happen any longer after 9-11. Is it true or not true that small planes fly very near or over Manhatten these days?

I was watching the breaking news coverage. Almost simultaneously we hear that there is no indication that it was terrorism and that it was an accident. I can understand the skepticism of terrorism, but how does anyone decide that it was an accident instead of intentional? That decision would seem to have required more knowledge than we were being given watching the live coverage.

Declaring it an accident suggested to me that authorities already knew more than we were being told. Then the reports start coming in with number of dead, then the airport the plane left from, then the registered owner and declared pilot, then the number of people (dead) that were on board the plane.

It looks to me like authorities may have known the facts about this plane and occupants, but could not release details until next of kin could be notified first. They may not have been able to say, "We are convinced it was an accident because Cory Lidle was flying the plane (with passengers) and there is no reason to suspect it was intentional. But we haven't informed his family of this yet."

So, what struck me odd was that it was confidently declared an accident. I think authorities knew more than the audience did. Maybe not.

--------------------
Terrified, mortified, petrified, stupefied... by you!

Posts: 3157 | From: Illinois | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Brad from Georgia
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


Icon 1 posted      Profile for Brad from Georgia   Author's Homepage   E-mail Brad from Georgia   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Barns & No Bull:
... Almost simultaneously we hear that there is no indication that it was terrorism and that it was an accident. I can understand the skepticism of terrorism, but how does anyone decide that it was an accident instead of intentional? ....

One of my editors, a big Yankee fan, called me at home a few minutes ago and said that on the local NY news they were reporting that the pilot of the plane sent out a distress call immediately before the crash.

--------------------
"No hard feelin's and HOPpy New Year!"--Walt Kelly
Hear what you're missing: ARTC podcasts! http://artcpodcast.org/

Posts: 7581 | From: Gainesville, Georgia | Registered: Jun 2000  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Delta-V
Xboxing Day


Icon 1 posted      Profile for Delta-V     Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Barns & No Bull:
Yeah, I thought Manhatten was controlled airspace... then I hear that small crafts commonly fly right past where this happened. I assumed that that stuff wasn't supposed to happen any longer after 9-11. Is it true or not true that small planes fly very near or over Manhatten these days?

You can fly General Aviation aircraft in controlled airspace, you just have to be equipped with a transponder and contact the ATC upon entering. Parts of NYC are now an ADIZ, so a flight plan is required, and some other restrictions.

--------------------
"My neighbor asked why anyone would need a car that can go 190 mph. If the answer isn't obvious, and explaination won't help." - Csabe Csere

Posts: 1225 | From: Wichita, Kansas | Registered: Nov 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Canuckistan
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


Icon 06 posted      Profile for Canuckistan   E-mail Canuckistan   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
CNN is confirming that Cory Lidle is among the fatalities.

--------------------
People need to stop appropriating Jesus as their reason for behaving badly. It's so irritating. (Avril)

Posts: 8429 | From: New York run by the Swiss (Toronto) | Registered: Mar 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Mr. Furious
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


Icon 1 posted      Profile for Mr. Furious   Author's Homepage   E-mail Mr. Furious   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
The whole thing is very sad. I don't know details about the other people who were killed, but Lidle left behind a wife and a 6 year old son.

--------------------
"He's not gonna let me in, I'm Mr. Dirty Mouth!"
- Jeffrey Coho (Craig Bierko), Boston Legal

Posts: 8729 | From: North Carolina | Registered: Jan 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Zorro
Little Sales Drummer Boy


Icon 1 posted      Profile for Zorro     Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
According to local NYC news, they were essentially taking a sightseeing tour- took off from NJ, flew south, looped around the Statue of Liberty, around lower Manhattan, north up the East Side.

There are several companies in the area that do sightseeing helicopter tours of NYC; I don't know about small planes, though.

--------------------
"Seize the day! Make your lives extraordinary!"
-John Keating, "Dead Poets Society"

Posts: 2861 | From: New Jersey | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Canuckistan
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


Icon 102 posted      Profile for Canuckistan   E-mail Canuckistan   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
I've been on one of those helicopter tours, although this was in 2002, so getting anywhere near the Statue of Liberty just wasn't an option.

I'd imagine small planes would be able to take a similar route to what we did.

--------------------
People need to stop appropriating Jesus as their reason for behaving badly. It's so irritating. (Avril)

Posts: 8429 | From: New York run by the Swiss (Toronto) | Registered: Mar 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Singing in the Drizzle
Jingle Bell Hock


Icon 1 posted      Profile for Singing in the Drizzle     Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
It seems to me that a small plane or helicopter crashs into some building in NYC every 5 to 10 years. The only thing that should be shocking news it that Cory Lidle was in the plane and died.
Posts: 597 | From: Bellingham, WA | Registered: Nov 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Jason Threadslayer
Let There Be PCs on Earth


Icon 1 posted      Profile for Jason Threadslayer     Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
Notams

--------------------
All posts foretold by Nostradamus.

Turing test failures: 6

Posts: 5481 | From: Decatur, GA | Registered: Nov 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Class Bravo
We Wish You a Merry Giftmas


Icon 1 posted      Profile for Class Bravo     Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Delta-V:
You can fly General Aviation aircraft in controlled airspace, you just have to be equipped with a transponder and contact the ATC upon entering.

Unless it's Class Bravo or Class Echo airspace.
Posts: 918 | From: Southern CA | Registered: Jan 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Echinodermata Q. Taft
It Came Upon a Midnight Clearance


Icon 1 posted      Profile for Echinodermata Q. Taft   Author's Homepage     Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
Someone at Fark.com linked this painful column from last Febrary, by a sportswriter who was taken for an airplane ride by Cory Lidle, then a licensed pilot for only about a week.

quote:
"It's totally safe," Lidle said, reassuring me. "You'll get an engine quit in a 5-year-old Mercedes more than you'll get this engine to quit. People don't understand it. And if it quits, we'd have plenty of time to glide to where I can land somewhere."
Ouch.

I feel bad for the guy (and whoever his passenger was), but thankful that the casulaties weren't much worse. I heard there's a hospital close by he might have crashed into, for instance.

--------------------
http://eqtaft.blogspot.com

Hope for the future! http://www.runobama.com

Posts: 3218 | From: San Diego, CA | Registered: Jul 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Finite Fourier Alchemy
Markdown, the Herald Angels Sing


Icon 1 posted      Profile for Finite Fourier Alchemy   E-mail Finite Fourier Alchemy   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Class Bravo:
quote:
Originally posted by Delta-V:
You can fly General Aviation aircraft in controlled airspace, you just have to be equipped with a transponder and contact the ATC upon entering.

Unless it's Class Bravo or Class Echo airspace.
Er, you still need a transponder for Class B.

General Aviation VFR requirements:
Class G and E: none (G is uncontrolled, E is most General Aviation airspace)
Class D: radio contact with ATC (airport with tower, no radar)
Class C: radio contact with ATC and mode C (busier airport, radar)
Class B: ATC clearance and mode C. (very busy airport)
Class A: A different aircraft... (>18,000 feet, IFR, etc.)

Bonus points: Special use airspace, Alert areas, Military operations areas, Warning areas, Restricted areas, prohibited areas, national security areas, TFR, etc.

(Experience the freedom of flight! [Smile] )

--------------------
Thinking about New England / missing old Japan

Posts: 2603 | From: Virginia | Registered: Mar 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Canuckistan
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


Icon 102 posted      Profile for Canuckistan   E-mail Canuckistan   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Echinodermata Q. Taft:
I heard there's a hospital close by he might have crashed into, for instance.

In fact, the building he crashed into does house a hospital of sorts.

quote:
The building is a condominium with residents like Marvin R. Shanken, the publisher of Cigar Aficionado and other specialty magazines; Marvin S. Traub, the former head of Bloomingdale’s; and Carol Higgins Clark, a mystery writer who is the daughter of Mary Higgins Clark. A dozen lower floors are used by the Hospital for Special Surgery for offices and guest rooms for patients’ families.


--------------------
People need to stop appropriating Jesus as their reason for behaving badly. It's so irritating. (Avril)

Posts: 8429 | From: New York run by the Swiss (Toronto) | Registered: Mar 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Class Bravo
We Wish You a Merry Giftmas


Icon 1 posted      Profile for Class Bravo     Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Finite Fourier Alchemy:
quote:
Originally posted by Class Bravo:
quote:
Originally posted by Delta-V:
You can fly General Aviation aircraft in controlled airspace, you just have to be equipped with a transponder and contact the ATC upon entering.

Unless it's Class Bravo or Class Echo airspace.
Er, you still need a transponder for Class B.

General Aviation VFR requirements:
Class G and E: none (G is uncontrolled, E is most General Aviation airspace)
Class D: radio contact with ATC (airport with tower, no radar)
Class C: radio contact with ATC and mode C (busier airport, radar)
Class B: ATC clearance and mode C. (very busy airport)
Class A: A different aircraft... (>18,000 feet, IFR, etc.)

Bonus points: Special use airspace, Alert areas, Military operations areas, Warning areas, Restricted areas, prohibited areas, national security areas, TFR, etc.

(Experience the freedom of flight! [Smile] )

I am well aware of the transponder requirements.

I am a controller at a Class B facility.

My point was that the blanket statement of "you can fly into controlled airspace with a transponder and contacting ATC upon entering" is not quite correct. It is correct for Class Charlie and Delta installations (assuming the controller on initial contact reads back your callsign and does not tell you to remain clear of the Class C or D airspace), but a *clearance* is required to enter Class B airspace and a transponder is not required in Class E (which is controlled) airspace below 10,000' MSL if that altitude is above 1,200' AGL, as long as you are not within the 30 NM Mode C Veil around a Class B facility. Additionally, an IFR flight plan in an IFR equipped aircraft with an IFR qualified pilot is required to enter Class A airspace, which also falls under the category of "controlled airspace."

Posts: 918 | From: Southern CA | Registered: Jan 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Artemis
The First USA Noel


Icon 15 posted      Profile for Artemis   E-mail Artemis   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
Things are getting rough on the Upper East Side. Between the suicidal doctor blowing his apartment up last summer and this plane crash, venturing above the 40's is getting precarious to say the least.

--------------------
"You can't play Electro-magnetic Golf according to the rules of Centrifugal Bumble Puppy."
-Mustapha Mond, "Brave New World"

Posts: 679 | From: New York | Registered: Oct 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Pseudo_Croat
Angels Wii Have Heard on High


Icon 06 posted      Profile for Pseudo_Croat   Author's Homepage   E-mail Pseudo_Croat   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
Accidents are always tragic, be they car, boat, or plane. When an accident takes the life of an even marginally well-known person, it becomes all the more tragic.

My thoughts are with Mr. Lidle's family and friends.

- Pseudo (not a good way to strike out) Croat

--------------------
"At all events, people who deny the influence of smaller nations should remember that the Croats have the rest of us by the throats." - Norman Davies, Europe: A History

God wants spiritual fruits, not religious nuts.

Posts: 4578 | From: Sunrise, FL | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Lainie
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


Icon 1 posted      Profile for Lainie   E-mail Lainie   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Pseudo_Croat:
Accidents are always tragic, be they car, boat, or plane. When an accident takes the life of an even marginally well-known person, it becomes all the more tragic.

I don't think it becomes more tragic. I think more people are touched by the tragedy because more people are at least glancingly familiar with the person(s) affected.

--------------------
How homophobic do you have to be to have penguin gaydar? - Lewis Black

Posts: 8322 | From: Columbus, OH | Registered: Aug 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Canuckistan
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


Icon 302 posted      Profile for Canuckistan   E-mail Canuckistan   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
Oh, the tinfoil hats came out quickly on this one.

Some comments from ... um, less-thoughtful people than those on these boards.

--------------------
People need to stop appropriating Jesus as their reason for behaving badly. It's so irritating. (Avril)

Posts: 8429 | From: New York run by the Swiss (Toronto) | Registered: Mar 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Doug4.7
Angels Wii Have Heard on High


Icon 98 posted      Profile for Doug4.7   E-mail Doug4.7   Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Canuckistan:
Oh, the tinfoil hats came out quickly on this one.

Some comments from ... um, less-thoughtful people than those on these boards.

Thanks for the link. My favorite comment was
quote:
This is most definitely another terrorist attack! After all, the United States is the greatest country in the world, so accidents don't occur within its borders. Also, when you turn '10/11/6' upside down you get '9/11/01' and we all know that Al-Qaeda is into numerology.
'bout fell out of my chair on that one. [lol] [lol] [lol]

--------------------
And now for something completely different...

Posts: 4164 | From: Alabama | Registered: Oct 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Mistletoey Chloe
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


Icon 1 posted      Profile for Mistletoey Chloe     Send new private message       Edit/Delete post   Reply with quote 
Dear snopesters: please accept my enormous and heartfelt gratitude for not being like the people whose comments Canuck just linked to. Honestly.

--------------------
~~Ai am in mai prrrrrraime!~~

Posts: 10111 | From: Oklahoma | Registered: Sep 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
  This topic comprises 2 pages: 1  2   

Quick Reply
Message:

HTML is enabled.
UBB Code™ is enabled.

Instant Graemlins
   


Post new topic  Post a reply Close topic   Feature Topic   Move Topic   Delete topic next oldest topic   next newest topic
 - Printer-friendly view of this topic
Hop To:


Urban Legends Reference Pages

Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classic™ 6.7.2