posted
Something doesn't sound right about this whole thing. How exactly did the magnets manage to not get stuck together in the childs stomach before they moved into the intestine? Did he eat one magnet then wait a while before eating the next? I suppose that is possible but not the most likely thing in the world.
I would think that if you ate two magnets within a few minutes they would get stuck together in your stomach and then migrate through the GI tract together.
Posts: 629 | From: Greenwood, IN | Registered: Dec 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Lainie: As I explained above, I expect the toy not to fall apart when used, in the manner intended, by children of the age for which the toy is intended.
Yet you seem to assume that the child used the toy in a normal manner when it fell apart.
quote:Some kids do, sometimes. But neither the OP story, nor the (admittedly anecdotal) evidence of the posters here who've reported the magnets falling out, indicate that the toys were destroyed or even damaged. What's reported is that the magnets fell out during normal use. If that's not true, my point is moot. If it is true, then there is a quality issue with the product. Again, I'm not speaking to the manufacturer's liability for the child's death, but for the manufacturer's responsibility to give their customers their money's worth.
And most people who are involved in fender-benders are the safest drivers in the world. All we know is that the magnets fell out of the toy when an adolescent was using it. It could be just as likely that the kid pried the magnets out of it (though I'm not saying this happened). But if the mother wasn't around to see her child ingest two of the magnets, we can easily assume that she *was* around to supervise her adolescent using the toy properly?
Either way, If you're just arguing that they make a crappy product if the magnets fall out with normal use, nobody here will disagree with you. The question I am arguing is whether the company is liable for the child's death.
quote:No. Do you have any evidence that the toys in question were 10 years old when they fell apart?
Does it matter? If the toy is one day old or ten years old, it should not fall apart, right?
quote:Again, if she's hard on her toys, or technologically incompetent, that's not the manufacturer's responsbility. I never said it was.
-------------------- The opinions expressed herein do not represent those of any rational human being and are solely for the purpose of entertainment. Posts: 487 | From: Brick City (Newark), NJ | Registered: Jan 2003
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quote:Originally posted by reflex: Either way, If you're just arguing that they make a crappy product if the magnets fall out with normal use, nobody here will disagree with you.
Did you read my post, the one you're quoting? I stated very clearly that I was arguing exactly that. If you're arguing a different point, quote somebody else.
quote:
quote:No. Do you have any evidence that the toys in question were 10 years old when they fell apart?
Does it matter? If the toy is one day old or ten years old, it should not fall apart, right?
Nice selective quoting. You left out the part where you said:
quote: Do you expect a toy to look the same ten years from now as it did the day you bought it?
-------------------- How homophobic do you have to be to have penguin gaydar? - Lewis Black Posts: 8322 | From: Columbus, OH | Registered: Aug 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Chloe: But of course, African magnets are non-migratory.
Oh, well done!
-------------------- "We don't keep a certified whale-vomit expert on staff." - Larry Penny, Director, Natural Resources Department, Town of East Hampton Posts: 377 | From: New Zealand | Registered: Nov 2005
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One child died and four others suffered serious injuries after swallowing tiny magnets found in building sets sold nationwide, the Consumer Product Safety Commission said in announcing a recall of 3.8 million of the toy kits.
posted
Instead of keeping the magnets in place with adhesive, they could simply shape the magnets differently. Right now the magnets are simple cylinders which can slide out. If they were shaped like an hour-glass, or like dumb-bells, then when the molten plastic is injection molded around the magnet the magnet would be held in place by it's own shape.
I bought some of those Magnetix for my nephew for Christmas (he's 10.) AFAIK, he hasn't had any problem with them falling out.
Steve S
Posts: 194 | From: St. Louis | Registered: Nov 2004
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posted
Just checked my kids and they are shaped more like dumb bells. And they are the Magnetix by RoseArt. I also bought them for the kids at Christmas. 9 sets (3 each for the younger ones)250 pieces per set. And we have had no problems with the magnets falling out on any. My kids are 9,11,and 13. I do have younger nieces and nephews that come around, they play with them when the older kids are with them. If not all pieces are picked up and counted to make sure there are no missing pieces.
-------------------- A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wits and add drama to an otherwise dull day! -Calvin and Hobbes Posts: 251 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Dec 2005
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quote:Originally posted by momto4+: Just checked my kids and they are shaped more like dumb bells.
Not to be taken out of context.
-------------------- "Strength is the capacity to break a chocolate bar into four pieces with your bare hands - and then eat just one of the pieces." Judith Viorst Posts: 1082 | From: Luzern, Switzerland | Registered: Jan 2005
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quote:Originally posted by momto4+: I do have younger nieces and nephews that come around, they play with them when the older kids are with them. If not all pieces are picked up and counted to make sure there are no missing pieces.
Just to be clear, all the pieces could be there, and the magnets could still have fallen out. The pieces need to be checked to make sure they're still magnetic. If one or more isn't, then you need to look for missing magnets.
-------------------- How homophobic do you have to be to have penguin gaydar? - Lewis Black Posts: 8322 | From: Columbus, OH | Registered: Aug 2005
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quote:Originally posted by momto4+: Just checked my kids and they are shaped more like dumb bells. And they are the Magnetix by RoseArt.
Are you talking about the magnets themselves, or the plastic stick pieces. I know the plastic pieces are sort of dumb-bell shaped. But I think the magnets are just cylindrical.
Steve S.
Posts: 194 | From: St. Louis | Registered: Nov 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Rhiandmoi: The company could have and should have forseen that the magnets could fall off and be ingested by the younger siblings of the children their toys are target at.
I suspect they did. Hence, the choking hazard warning.
As for those who think the toy should not be falling apart under normal use....ever had to replace a fan belt in your car? A light bulb in your refrigerator? A glass that broke in your dishwasher? Have you sued the appropriate comapnies because these items failed to operate "under normal use"?
-------------------- Back in the days before electricity, we were forced to watch TV by candlelight. Posts: 229 | From: Paoli, PA | Registered: Dec 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Rhiandmoi: The company could have and should have forseen that the magnets could fall off and be ingested by the younger siblings of the children their toys are target at.
I suspect they did. Hence, the choking hazard warning.
But as was mentioned earlier in the thread, the point is that the child did not choke to death so the choking warning doesn't absolve them of responsibility. The parents had no way of knowing that once the magnets were ingested that they wouldn't just work their way out of the child's system when nature took it's (usually) inevitable course.
Had they known there was a potential for this to happen they might have sought medical aid sooner.
-------------------- If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, it's just possible you haven't grasped the situation. - Jean Kerr Posts: 18428 | From: Ontario, Canada | Registered: Nov 2001
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quote:Originally posted by NobbyNobbs: As for those who think the toy should not be falling apart under normal use....ever had to replace a fan belt in your car? A light bulb in your refrigerator? A glass that broke in your dishwasher? Have you sued the appropriate comapnies because these items failed to operate "under normal use"?
Fan belts and lightbulbs are consumables; it's understood upon purchase that they have a certain functional lifespan. If a company manufactured fan belts that broke, or lightbulbs that burned out, early in what should have been that lifespan, they probably wouldn't get sued, but I for one would stop buying their crappy products. And not everybody here has said the company making these toys should be sued over the magnets falling out. I have said, more than once, that the toys are shoddily made. Eliminate the quality problem and you also make the product safer. It's a win-win situation.
And the only time I've ever had a glass break in the dishwasher was when I loaded the dishwasher improperly. Which is not normal use.
-------------------- How homophobic do you have to be to have penguin gaydar? - Lewis Black Posts: 8322 | From: Columbus, OH | Registered: Aug 2005
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posted
The kid didn't die because the magnets fell out. The kid died because he ate several magnets over a period of time, causing the magnets to be spread out over his intestines. He wouldn't have died if he hadn't eaten the magnets. He wouldn't have died if someone had kept him from injesting magnets over a period of time so that they wouldn't have been spread out through his intestines. Magnets falling out onto the floor was not the cause of death. Magnets on the floor cannot possibly kill someone. The kid picked up the magnets and ate them over a period of time with no one watching him.
It wouldn't have mattered if it was magnets, bleach, thumbtacks, glass or batteries. The parents weren't watching him, they had no idea what he ate, and he died from injesting the magnets over a period of time while left unattended.
Now, show me a case where children were ever harmed during normal use of the toy, and then you have a case.
Posts: 439 | From: Redondo Beach, CA | Registered: Sep 2005
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quote:Originally posted by momto4+: Just checked my kids and they are shaped more like dumb bells.
Not to be taken out of context.
Thats kinda funny when you put it that way.
-------------------- A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wits and add drama to an otherwise dull day! -Calvin and Hobbes Posts: 251 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Dec 2005
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posted
Lainie---We check the pieces when they are put away. I always have even before this topic came up. Toys have a way of sometimes falling apart when you have 4 young children. Especially when you have 2 that like to see how things "work" I meant to put that in my original post, sorry I no longer have 4 young ones. The oldest is now 17. But, like I said we do have little kids that are here all the time. And they are supervised when questionable toys ie: toys with small parts that may come loose or fall off, are being played with.
Steve S. --- I got my kids the fluorescent ones, so if I hold them up to the light, you are right. But, they are kinda long and I cant see how they would fall out and nobody would notice.
I have to agree with Magpie this would not have happened if someone was watching the children who are too young to play with these toys.
-------------------- A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wits and add drama to an otherwise dull day! -Calvin and Hobbes Posts: 251 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Dec 2005
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Rhiandmoi
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV
posted
I think the main issue is that no one told them that they should seek immediate medical help in the case of ingestion of magnets. Since the child did not choke on the magnet the choking warning wasn't really applicable. I am pretty sure that if the child was choking they would have sought help immediately.
-------------------- I think that hyperbole is the single greatest factor contributing to the decline of society. - My friend Pat.
posted
When my youngest daughter was 5 she stuck a watch battery up her nose. No where on the package did it say harmful if stuck up your nose. But, it is. If it is still in the nose it can burn through her nose if it starts to leak. If it is in her sinuses it can also cause the same damage. If it makes it to her stomach it can burst and put battery acid in her stomach. All dangerous incidents. And yes it can happen. I thought it was funny till the doctor told me what could happen. The battery got stuck just past the indent in her nose. The doctors tried to get her to blow her nose but, it wouldnt work. So she had to have surgery to remove it. So going by what some have suggested here. I should sue the makers of the battery because they did not warn me that putting a watch battery up your nose is dangerous/harmful?
-------------------- A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wits and add drama to an otherwise dull day! -Calvin and Hobbes Posts: 251 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Dec 2005
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Rhiandmoi
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV
posted
They probably did warn you on the package.
Well actually they warn about swallowing a battery. I just checked a watch battery package and it says:
Caution: Battery can explode or leak if heated, disassembled, shorted, recharged, exposed to fire or high temperature or inserted incorrectly. Do not carry batteries loose in your pocket or purse. Keep batteries away from children. If swallowed, consult a physician at once. For information on treatment, call (202) 625-3333 collect.
That's all the Magnetix people need to put on their packaging. If swallowed contact a physician immediately.
-------------------- I think that hyperbole is the single greatest factor contributing to the decline of society. - My friend Pat.
posted
But one of the kids inhaled a magnet and it got stuck in his lung. He had to have it surgically removed. Do they need a label on the package "Do not snort magnets up your nose"? I really don't think it's the toy manufacturer's responsiblity to think up every possible misuse of their toy and write a warning for it.
Posts: 439 | From: Redondo Beach, CA | Registered: Sep 2005
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posted
I know it says harmful if swallowed but, putting it up the nose isnt swallowing. And I didnt realise that it can cause such damage to the nasal area, passage and sinuses. (Just like the parents in the OP probably didnt realise that swallowing a magnet(s) can cause death.) And since the battery package doent say that,then by the OP I should sue.
Just to go by what you put: The parents should contact a physician immediately. However they didnt know immediately. And common sense would be that when the package says harmful if swallowed. Not intended for children under 3. And you have a child under 3 in the house. Do not play with any of these toys in an area where the child under 3 can get to them or the parts that have fallen off. It really isnt hard to have a designated play area for older/younger children.
-------------------- A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wits and add drama to an otherwise dull day! -Calvin and Hobbes Posts: 251 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Dec 2005
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quote:Originally posted by magpie: But one of the kids inhaled a magnet and it got stuck in his lung. He had to have it surgically removed. Do they need a label on the package "Do not snort magnets up your nose"? I really don't think it's the toy manufacturer's responsiblity to think up every possible misuse of their toy and write a warning for it.
Once again I agree. If they did that there would be no room for putting on the package what was actually in the package. Instead in giant letters it would read: HARMFUL IF: and the an entire package filled with every possible scenario on what a child might do.
-------------------- A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wits and add drama to an otherwise dull day! -Calvin and Hobbes Posts: 251 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Dec 2005
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Rhiandmoi
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV
posted
The package doesn't say harmful if swallowed. It says this is a choking hazard. It might sound like a nitpick, but these are very different hazards.
-------------------- I think that hyperbole is the single greatest factor contributing to the decline of society. - My friend Pat.
posted
Well since you cant choke on it unless you try to swallow it then choking hazard would fall under the harmful if swallowed warning. So they should have just put harmful if swallowed. But then you would get someone who said well I didnt swallow it I choked on it. So like Magpie said it shouldnt be the responsibility of the manufacturer to cover all incidents that may occur and put it on the box. They must be some responsibility on the part of the consumer to use common sense.
edited because my brain is faster than my fingers.
-------------------- A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wits and add drama to an otherwise dull day! -Calvin and Hobbes Posts: 251 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Dec 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Rhiandmoi: Well actually they warn about swallowing a battery. I just checked a watch battery package and it says:
Caution: Battery can explode or leak if heated, disassembled, shorted, recharged, exposed to fire or high temperature or inserted incorrectly.
I would say that if you have put a watch battery up your nose, then you have definitely inserted it incorrectly.
I'll get it.
-------------------- Back in the days before electricity, we were forced to watch TV by candlelight. Posts: 229 | From: Paoli, PA | Registered: Dec 2005
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posted
I asked my daughter why she did it, her answer: "Because it fit"
-------------------- A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wits and add drama to an otherwise dull day! -Calvin and Hobbes Posts: 251 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Dec 2005
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posted
Hey folks, please read the Product Recall/Replacement notice from the US CPSC. 30 kids of varying ages have been injured and one died from magnetic toys in this particular line, Magnetix. Please spread the word to increase awareness about the dangers of magnets for young children. You can see the release here http://spaces.msn.com/magnetscankill/Posts: 1 | From: Redmond, WA | Registered: Apr 2006
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posted
A Mom- I'm not sure you quite grasp the concept behind snopes.com. A website like that is the typical OMGWTF fearmongering that makes people freak out. When things are titled "Magnets Can Kill" you should really follow that up with "When Eaten, but are harmless externally"
Posts: 439 | From: Redondo Beach, CA | Registered: Sep 2005
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posted
Oh, I don't know. When my brother was little he put a heavy-duty magnet on the screen on our brand-new color tv set (the first color one we'd ever had). All the color rushed into a magnet-shape on the screen. I'm sure my dad was a little tempted to kill him.
-------------------- ~~Ai am in mai prrrrrraime!~~ Posts: 10111 | From: Oklahoma | Registered: Sep 2004
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posted
My friends three year old swallowed two magnets from her big brothers magnetix earlier this week. She had found them and luckily told her mum as soon as she swallowed them. I had told her mum about this thread before and she took her daughter to the nearest childrens hospital because the local A+E refused to see the kid because they have no surgical facilities for young kids. An X-Ray showed that the magnets had joined together within her stomach and they decided to let nature take its course. The magnets came out all by themselves and had corroded and totally fused together when recovered.
I wonder if they will recall them in the UK too.
-------------------- I tried to get in touch with my inner child, but she isn't allowed to talk to strangers. Posts: 674 | From: Scotland | Registered: May 2004
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