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Author Topic: Erectile Dysfunction and Pleasure/Performance
Silas Sparkhammer
I Saw V-Chips Come Sailing In


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Hm...not necessarily speaking from personal experience here...

Erectile Dysfunction (limp as a noodle) is a big advertising thing these days. And, yes, it should not be minimized as a sign of vascular illness. Inability to straighten the old firehose can lead to other ailments.

But... Is an erection necessary for sexual pleasure, either giving or receiving? So long as the nerves are working, don't they connect to the pleasure centers of the brain? Wouldn't rubbing uglies still be fun, leading to climax? From the partner's point of view, does a man's thingus have to be as long and hard as a cathedral candle to provide pleasure? Wouldn't a kind of rubbery, flubbery tribadism be fun too?

You see cartoons, and scenes in dramas, and so on, where the guy can't get it up, so he just sits there and mopes, and moves away from his partner. And I keep thinking, why? Why let that stop you?

One further question: isn't it possible that a non-erect penis can serve to provide the possessor with multiple orgasms, given that the major limitation on repeat performances is the loss of erection?

Again, this is not to minimize the real medical issues involved, but only to ask if the sexual issues haven't been overstressed? In another area, we're talking about women and body-image politics; isn't this an example for men?

Silas (suspendata como un gerbil)

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Dancin' Fool
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Hm...I have many body parts, why not use them all? I am not a porno star by any means, but I am committed to bringing pleasure and satisfaction to all who come to the party!

PS: It is a two person party, me and wifey - no photos please...

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Oceanic Aura
The First USA Noel


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I'd always though that most ED was caused by psychological problems, not physical. I seem to recall reading something that purported that most men with ED can still masturbate, and do so frequently. Has anyone else heard this?

Anyway...TMI TMI TMI TMI TMI TMI

I get off best by oral anyway, so as a woman, I could be satisfied without a giant, throbbing erection. But, I'd feel pretty bad about not doing anything for the other guy!
quote:
One further question: isn't it possible that a non-erect penis can serve to provide the possessor with multiple orgasms, given that the major limitation on repeat performances is the loss of erection?
Men can have multiple orgasms without ejaculation, but I'm not sure they could orgasm without erection. I believe that the orgasm and the ejaculation are frequently simultaneous, but you can have one without the other. I knew a guy who had multiples everytime he had sex. Lucky guy. I was skeptical myself, till I found out for sure first hand! At least one of us had a good time. [lol]

Edited because 'sceptical' is not skeptical.

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"Are we talking misdemeanor trouble or squeal like a pig trouble?"

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DesertRat
It Came Upon a Midnight Clearance


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quote:
Men can have multiple orgasms without ejaculation, but I'm not sure they could orgasm without erection
TMITMITMITMITMITMITMITMITMITMITMITMITMITMI


Acendotal evidence--I have had orgasms while only semi-erect, closer to flaccid than erect. I have never had one wile completely flaccid, though; I doubt it can be done.

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Eddylizard
We Wish You a Merry Giftmas


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quote:
Originally posted by DesertRat:
quote:
Men can have multiple orgasms without ejaculation, but I'm not sure they could orgasm without erection
TMITMITMITMITMITMITMITMITMITMITMITMITMITMI


Acendotal evidence--I have had orgasms while only semi-erect, closer to flaccid than erect. I have never had one wile completely flaccid, though; I doubt it can be done.

Errm I have this err... friend, yeah thats it, and I can (I mean he can.)

ETA Whilst flying solo.

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"Ladies and gentlemen, this is what is commonly known as money. It comes in all sizes, colours, and denominations - like people."

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Oceanic Aura
The First USA Noel


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When you guys have orgasm like that, do you ejaculate as well, or is it a so-called 'dry' orgasm?

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"Are we talking misdemeanor trouble or squeal like a pig trouble?"

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Eddylizard
We Wish You a Merry Giftmas


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quote:
Originally posted by Oceanic Aura:
When you guys have orgasm like that, do you ejaculate as well, or is it a so-called 'dry' orgasm?

There is ejaculation.

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"Ladies and gentlemen, this is what is commonly known as money. It comes in all sizes, colours, and denominations - like people."

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Lonely Mountain
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quote:
Originally posted by Oceanic Aura:
I'd always though that most ED was caused by psychological problems, not physical. I seem to recall reading something that purported that most men with ED can still masturbate, and do so frequently. Has anyone else heard this?

FYI - This info is not from personal experience. [Razz]

Erectile disfunction can be psychological but this is usually something they ask about initially. Usually if you have qan erection occasionally, it's psychological. If it never happens, then there are probably phsyical issues. The physical issues can be vascular (insufficient blood flow), nerve damage, low hormone levels, and/or reactions to medications or drugs. These problems can be created by lots of different medical problems like trauma, heart disease, or diabetes.

ETA - One more thing, again not from personal experience. ED is about the ability to have an erection, regardless of "outcome." The inability to have an orgasm is called retarded or delayed ejaculation which may or may not have co-morbidity with ED.

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"Tis too much proved that with devotion's visage and pious action we do sugar o'er the devil himself." - Hamlet

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Oceanic Aura
The First USA Noel


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Why do all men have the need to preface everything about an inability to gain an erection with a "not me personally"?

What's the stigma? Actually, I know what the stigma is. I should say, why the stigma?

Sorry to derail your thread, Silas. But both you and now Loney Mt. have said the same thing and I hear it often enough elsewhere to wonder why.

Edit: Sorry if that sounds bitchy. It's not at all! Just pure curiosity.

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"Are we talking misdemeanor trouble or squeal like a pig trouble?"

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Artemis
The First USA Noel


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quote:
Originally posted by Lonely Mountain:

Erectile disfunction can be psychological but this is usually something they ask about initially. Usually if you have qan erection occasionally, it's psychological. If it never happens, then there are probably phsyical issues.

More specifically, what I've heard, is that if you can achieve an erection during REM sleep, then it's probably not a physical cause. Hence, the "stamp test" (putting a roll of stamps around a man's penis while flaccid--if it breaks, then he was able to achieve erection during REM sleep, and thus doesn't have a physical problem).
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Ana Ng
Let There Be PCs on Earth


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Am I going crazy? Am I the only person sitting here thinking, "No- no, it cannot be done," and scratching my head?

It's not about the guy's **** being hard to enhance pleasure, from my understanding of the sex I've had in my life, it is impossible for a non-erect **** to penetrate anything down there.

Am I missing something here?

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My great grandfather planted that tree!

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Artemis
The First USA Noel


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I think what they're saying, Anna Ng is that even without an erection, couldn't a man rub genitals up against his partner, thus resulting in sexual pleasure. Or his partner could perform oral sex on him without an erection, even if penetration itself would not be possible.
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Ana Ng
Let There Be PCs on Earth


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Certainly. But have you ever tried it? You can't do that for long. It drives you absolutely nuts. It's like watching the TV when the antenna's broken or trying to use the phone when there's next to no signal.

Possible, but frustrating, and something for which a curative pill is, I think, perfectly appropriate.

I could see being driven crazy by that if I were a guy.

Edited for typos.

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My great grandfather planted that tree!

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Midgard_Dragon
Markdown, the Herald Angels Sing


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What, exactly, is the nuts driving factor, Ana? Are you saying just rubbing genatils would drive you nuts, or that giving and receiving oral or manual stimulation only (without any penetration) would drive you nuts? Or both?

Me, personally, I would die a happy man if I found a girl who generally just wanted to give and receive oral and manual stimulation, and only have penetrative sex occassionally. But I can see where you're be coming from if you're talking about just rubbing against each other.

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Ana Ng
Let There Be PCs on Earth


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Yes, just rubbing against each other. Fun, for like two minutes.

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robbiev - singin' off key
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To answer the OP, it is possible to have an orgasm without being fully hard. I don't know about completely limp though.

Going on a assumption that ED means simply "can't get it up, reason irrelevant", whether it feels good (at least to the man) depends on the reason.

There are hormone embalances that, in addition to causing inability to get or maintain an erection, can change the feeling (or negate it all together) and even though the actual act can be performed, and ejacualation can be reached, there is no feeling of anything.

ET: deleted a paragraph on the assumption that maybe nobody wanted more graphic details (and a spelling error)

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Every time I see a good looking woman, I think, "0oooh. There's another one I'll never have!"

Corvette. The louder you scream, the faster I'll go.

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Mad Jay
Let There Be PCs on Earth


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I think the problem is that most people equate an inability to maintain an erection with an inability to perform. There are multiple ways a man can give or receive pleasure without an erection, and many times, they do. However, oral/finger sex is often seen as a side-event to the main show. It's almost as if the man has to "prove" himself by sprouting an erection before he can have sex.

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Nico Sasha
In between my father's fields;And the citadels of the rule; Lies a no-man's land which I must cross; To find my stolen jewel.

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Silas Sparkhammer
I Saw V-Chips Come Sailing In


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Oceanic Aura: It's just one of those stupid social stigmas, which should go away with enlightenment. (I'm old enough to remember when no man would ever admit to masturbation. Nuh uh! That would imply incapability, weakness, and moral turpitude! We all read Playboy magazine for the articles! Now, that stupid stigma has weakened considerably, as witnessed by posts here on this thread.)

Ana Ng: and others: couldn't a flaccid penis still penetrate a vagina, if only a little, perhaps with some help from someone's hands? I've read that most of the nerve-endings in the vagina are near the entrance anyway. Seems to me that "rubbery flubbery" sex, while not the rock-hard pistoning of the dirty movies, could still be fun.

(What I *can* tell you from personal experience is that there is actually some minor advantage to be derived from an enlarged prostate: it makes ejaculation/orgasm more difficult to attain, and thus I have to work at it a lot harder. As opposed to seeking to delay and postpone and defer orgasm, now I seek for it with full energy. It gives me a lot more control over it, which, with care and practice, makes it better!)

Silas (our bodies, our selves)

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Troberg
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quote:
Ana Ng: and others: couldn't a flaccid penis still penetrate a vagina, if only a little, perhaps with some help from someone's hands? I've read that most of the nerve-endings in the vagina are near the entrance anyway. Seems to me that "rubbery flubbery" sex, while not the rock-hard pistoning of the dirty movies, could still be fun.
I havn't tried it (in fact, I think I'm incapable of not having an erection under such circumstances), but I've heard about it being like playing pool with a rope.

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/Troberg

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ThistleSoftware
Little Sales Drummer Boy


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In my experience if he is unable to maintain an erection it is time to change tactics entirely. Attempting vaginal penetrative sex with a limp penis is not pleasurable enough (for either of us) to justify the frustration and effort. Switching to oral usually either brings the encounter to fruition or takes care of the lack of erection.

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Officially Heartless

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Mad Jay
Let There Be PCs on Earth


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quote:
Originally posted by Silas Sparkhammer:
[

Ana Ng: and others: couldn't a flaccid penis still penetrate a vagina, if only a little, perhaps with some help from someone's hands? I've read that most of the nerve-endings in the vagina are near the entrance anyway. Seems to me that "rubbery flubbery" sex, while not the rock-hard pistoning of the dirty movies, could still be fun.

Peneteration with a fully flaccid penis? I suppose it's possible with some help, but what's the point? You might as well start using your fingers to stimulate your partner.

Peneteration with a semi-erect penis is possible, and it can be a turn-on if done properly, but if it takes too long, then the erection might go away. It can go either way. IMO, orally stimulating a semi-erect penis is the sure-shot way to acheive an erection

Caveat:- I am assuming that the goal of having sex is to have both partners orgasm. If the goal is to simply have some fun, do whatever you and your partner like. Knock yourself out.

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Nico Sasha
In between my father's fields;And the citadels of the rule; Lies a no-man's land which I must cross; To find my stolen jewel.

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Ana Ng
Let There Be PCs on Earth


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Okay, Silas, I'm going to make you an awesome ice cream sundae. And you're starving. Really NFBSKing hungry. Lots of excellent high quality ice cream, valrhona hot fudge, real homemade whipped cream, sufficient ice cold maraschino cherries.

You can lick at the whipped cream, maybe nibble on a sprinkle or two, but you can't actually *eat* any of it. Certainly not the cherries.

Would that be satisfying? This is a woman's POV, mind.

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Artemis
The First USA Noel


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I don't know. I don't really think the sundae analogy works for me. If you're saying that rubbing genitals and limp penetration is the equivalent of not being able to eat a sundae, that is. For me, penetration is only really secondary. And not even that necessary at all. As long as he knows how to wield a vibe, all is well. [Big Grin]

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"You can't play Electro-magnetic Golf according to the rules of Centrifugal Bumble Puppy."
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Oceanic Aura
The First USA Noel


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I tend to agree Artemis. Penetration is nice, sure, but it is not the best or most pleasurable way to get me off (actually, I can't orgasm at all without some kind of clitoral stimulation). I would think an impotent man might do a better job of it (sex in general, not just penetration) than a Hardcock McThrobby. Too many men labor under the delusion that 'insert and thrust repeatedly' is the key to a good time, and neglect more important areas.

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"Are we talking misdemeanor trouble or squeal like a pig trouble?"

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ThistleSoftware
Little Sales Drummer Boy


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Of course there are other sexual options besides penetration. However, attempting penetration or genital-to-genital contact is not in my experience the most pleasurable way to get around erectile dysfunction. I don't think Ana Ng is saying that it's better to give up, just that continuing to attempt penetrative vaginal intercourse is more likely to frustrate than anything else.

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Officially Heartless

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Silas Sparkhammer
I Saw V-Chips Come Sailing In


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quote:
Originally posted by Ana Ng:
Would that be satisfying? This is a woman's POV, mind.

Um...okay...but a lot of lesbians have entirely pleasurable sex without the use of penii or phallic substitutes...

I know of some women who pleasure themselves by rubbing against soft things like pillows...

I guess the obvious answer is: people have different pleasures! (And an obvious joke answer here is: a hot fudge sundae can still be good, even if it doesn't have a banana in it!)

Silas

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vanilla
Markdown, the Herald Angels Sing


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quote:
Originally posted by Silas Sparkhammer:
But... Is an erection necessary for sexual pleasure, either giving or receiving? So long as the nerves are working, don't they connect to the pleasure centers of the brain? Wouldn't rubbing uglies still be fun, leading to climax? From the partner's point of view, does a man's thingus have to be as long and hard as a cathedral candle to provide pleasure? Wouldn't a kind of rubbery, flubbery tribadism be fun too?

From this female's pov, a semi-hard or even flaccid penis can be pleasureable and fun. IME, after insertion with a fully erect/semi-hard penis, some of my more memorable orgasms have been after DH has gone soft, but still inserted.

Not to mention, that when dating and still a virgin, I had many partner induced orgasms that did not include taking off any clothes but lots of rubbing and heavy petting. Having fun sexually does not always mean that penetration has to happen.

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Yeah, I used to be pink. vanilla_pink.

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Dragon's Jewel
I Saw Three Shipments


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Mmmmm, several of the gentlemen have commented that oral pleasure is their preference, regardless of whether or not it's an ED issue. Is there any man (or woman with a man) who would put oral on the bottom of their list--or not on the list at all? Because my SO *hates* oral sex, and I've learned that it's the best way to make him lose his erection, so I'm curious if he's a complete oddity. (And not just with me, he's always hated it. I had to *talk him into* trying it). If ED ever became an issue for us, we'd be NFBSKed.
On the subject, I have to agree with Ana Ng, up to a point. The idea of attempting insertion with a flaccid penis just sounds incredibly frustrating. Now, a semi-flaccid penis that becomes fully erect after insertion, *that's* actually incredibly satisfying. My thing is, if the problem's in the motor, then I'd rather attempt other pleasure measures (hey, that's a good one) that have nothing to do with sticking anything inside of me.

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In the forest of the night
What immortal hand or eye
Hath framed thy fearful symmetry?

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Ramblin' Dave, quietly making noise
Markdown, the Herald Angels Sing


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quote:
Originally posted by Dragon's Jewel:

Is there any man (or woman with a man) who would put oral on the bottom of their list--or not on the list at all? Because my SO *hates* oral sex, and I've learned that it's the best way to make him lose his erection, so I'm curious if he's a complete oddity.

Do you mean he hates giving or receiving it (or both)? I always thought I'd hate giving it until I tried it, and then I discovered I really liked it. If I hadn't ever been eased into giving it a try, I could see having a similar attitude to your SO. I can take or leave receiving it - I don't hate it, but it's never been too high on my list either.

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Another lifetime I'd have fallen in love with you
Swept away by my feelings, ashamed and confused
But just now it's enough to be walking with you
Let the mystery play as it will! -Lui Collins

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ThistleSoftware
Little Sales Drummer Boy


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quote:
Originally posted by Silas Sparkhammer:
quote:
Originally posted by Ana Ng:
Would that be satisfying? This is a woman's POV, mind.

Um...okay...but a lot of lesbians have entirely pleasurable sex without the use of penii or phallic substitutes...

I know of some women who pleasure themselves by rubbing against soft things like pillows...

I guess the obvious answer is: people have different pleasures! (And an obvious joke answer here is: a hot fudge sundae can still be good, even if it doesn't have a banana in it!)

Silas

For me and my partner, continuing to involve the penis when it is not erect is more frustrating than pleasurable. However, oral or manual stimulation is lots of fun and often helps to firm things up again. Genital rubbing can be fun too but it would not be enough for either of us to orgasm, and I don't think my partner in particular is able to orgasm without erection anyway.

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Officially Heartless

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Dragon's Jewel
I Saw Three Shipments


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quote:
Do you mean he hates giving or receiving it (or both)?
Actually, he loves giving it (yay for me!) but he hates receiving it. We had one of those long discussions about it once where he told me that he'd never had anyone that really *tried* before (so it was never a good experience) and even though he appreciated the fact that I...err...gave it my all, if you will, it still ended up being a relaxing instead of pleasurable experience. Yes, he felt like I was giving his penis a relaxing massage.

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Tyger, Tyger burning bright
In the forest of the night
What immortal hand or eye
Hath framed thy fearful symmetry?

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put it in writing
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One of the only bits from the show Friends that stuck with me was when Joey and Chandler (I think) were discussing ED. Chandler was having a problem with it and was seeking advice. Joey admitted that it happened to him once.

Chandler: Well, what happened?
Joey (with a look of confusion at the question): We did it anyway!

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and it's 1 - 2 - 3, what are we fighting for? don't ask me, I don't give a damn

Posts: 1319 | From: Florida | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Silas Sparkhammer
I Saw V-Chips Come Sailing In


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quote:
Originally posted by put it in writing:
One of the only bits from the show Friends that stuck with me was when Joey and Chandler (I think) were discussing ED. Chandler was having a problem with it and was seeking advice. Joey admitted that it happened to him once.

Chandler: Well, what happened?
Joey (with a look of confusion at the question): We did it anyway!

Grin! That is what makes the most sense to me!

Silas

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Llewtrah
Happy Xmas (Warranty Is Over)


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With so many other ways to give pleasure, concentrating soley on "plug A in socket B" would be like going to a magnificent buffet and only eating the peanuts. OTOH, if the peanuts were off the menu I can understand that some people could get frustrated.

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Messybeast Cat Resource Archive
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Posts: 2040 | From: Chelmsford, Essex, England | Registered: Dec 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
caj48224
I'm Dreaming of a White Sale


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quote:
Originally posted by Dragon's Jewel:
On the subject, I have to agree with Ana Ng, up to a point. The idea of attempting insertion with a flaccid penis just sounds incredibly frustrating. Now, a semi-flaccid penis that becomes fully erect after insertion, *that's* actually incredibly satisfying. My thing is, if the problem's in the motor, then I'd rather attempt other pleasure measures (hey, that's a good one) that have nothing to do with sticking anything inside of me.

There's not much I can add, except that a friend called insertion of a semi-flaccid penis the same as "stuffing a marshmallow into a coin slot."

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"I reject your reality and substitute my own!" - Adam Savage, Mythbuster

Posts: 35 | From: Detroit, Michigan | Registered: Jun 2006  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
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