posted
Even cat bites that do not seem serious can result in a life-threatening infection.
-------------------- Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes. Posts: 2110 | From: Chicago, IL | Registered: Jul 2000
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posted
If a cat bit me and broke the skin, I'd probably just go to the ER. I'm highly allergic to cats, so heaven knows what type of reaction I'd have to a bite. Probably anaphylactic!
-------------------- Too broke to pay attention Posts: 452 | From: Omaha, NE | Registered: Aug 2005
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posted
I've worked at a vet clinic for 1.5 years and have never heard of this. Our vets have never mentioned it, and usually at least one staff member gets bitten and/or badly scratched on a daily basis. Currently I've got several 3" long claw marks on my arm. I sometimes clean my wounds with hydrogen peroxide but no one has ever treated bites or scratches as anything serious. Certainly no one on our current staff has ever gotten antibiotics for them. We're not even required to get any vaccinations or tetanus shots while working there...which probably says a lot about our boss's concern for personal safety.
-------------------- "There is no constitutional right to sleep with endangered reptiles." -- Carl Hiaasen Won't somebody please think of the adults! Posts: 8254 | From: Florida | Registered: Oct 2002
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posted
I have also had many cat bites with no nasty consequences - and never requiring more than anti-septic ointment.
However when I was growing up we did have one cat who "poisoned" another. (The same cat that was responsible for about 80% of the bites I have had - he could be vicious).
It was not a bite though. The two cats got into a fight, and his claw punctured the muscle in the shoulder of the other cat and infected it. The other cat went completely lame in that leg -though thankfully it was treatable.
The Vet did describe it as a poisoning, though it was clearly an infection not actual venom (though if there ever was a cat who should have been venomous...) so maybe your vet meant something similar ?
It is amazing how we put up with cat attacks though. This cat attacked me so badly on 2/3 occassions that he wrestled me to the ground. He liked to steal food from small children. He once bit my mother and ran off with her glasses. It was always particularly embarrassing to be attacked by him because he would only attack the weakest in a room. He attacked one woman, repeatedly biting her around the neck and shoulders while hanging from her hair - next time she visited she had short hair.
We would never have put up with a dog who behaved like that...but with cats you just accept they are like a natural force. We just warned everyone who came into the house, and were mostly unsympathetic when he bit people, because they had been warned.
He did have some good points, and is now greatly missed though. R.I.P. Bundle.
Victoria J
-------------------- Post accompanied by maniacal laughter. Posts: 577 | From: London, UK | Registered: Sep 2005
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quote:We would never have put up with a dog who behaved like that...but with cats you just accept they are like a natural force. We just warned everyone who came into the house, and were mostly unsympathetic when he bit people, because they had been warned.
I'm hoping you mean that you were unsympathetic to those who messed with a mean cat after being warned, as opposed to those who just entered the house and did nothing to provoke it. I've owned a dog, and I now own two cats. While I see what you're saying, I don't think I could accept that behavior from either type of pet.
I've certainly learned something today! I'm pretty allergic to cats, despite owning two (I'm not bright, but my allergies do seem to be getting better for the most part), and they've scratched me good a couple times (never bitten, just nipped), but now I'm going to be much more careful.
-------------------- "I shoot and crochet. I cook and mow the lawn. These things are not contradictions." -pirateslife Posts: 377 | From: Southern Illinois | Registered: Apr 2005
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posted
I've been scratched by cat claws and cat teeth (as opposed to a straight in puncture bite). They do take longer to heal than a normal scratch but I'm another lucky one; nothing ever went nasty. Maybe the reaction is partly due to personal immune systems?
Posts: 457 | From: Sacramento, CA | Registered: Jan 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Pando Raspox: I would hope so. This is just my personal experience. However, if you take antibiotics for bites or scratches that aren't serious, or ANY time it isn't completely necessary and you don't follow the directions and complete the prescription, it might not work the next time you really need that antibiotic. Then, you have to take stronger ones, etc. I'm just saying let your body try to heal itself-if the condition isn't SERIOUS-before you insist your doctor prescribe antibiotics.
I'm well-aware of the dangers of unnecessary antibiotics, and of the importance of completing a course of antibiotics once prescribed. I don't believe anyone here suggested that people bitten by cats insist that antibiotics be prescribed. I'm certain nobody suggested taking antibiotics for scratches. The suggestion has been made that people seek and follow medical advice for cat bites.
-------------------- How homophobic do you have to be to have penguin gaydar? - Lewis Black Posts: 8322 | From: Columbus, OH | Registered: Aug 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Samantha Vimes: I've been scratched by cat claws and cat teeth (as opposed to a straight in puncture bite). They do take longer to heal than a normal scratch but I'm another lucky one; nothing ever went nasty. Maybe the reaction is partly due to personal immune systems?
That may be part of it, but also, what you're describing sounds more like scratches and nips than deep bites.
-------------------- How homophobic do you have to be to have penguin gaydar? - Lewis Black Posts: 8322 | From: Columbus, OH | Registered: Aug 2005
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quote:Originally posted by piper: I'm hoping you mean that you were unsympathetic to those who messed with a mean cat after being warned, as opposed to those who just entered the house and did nothing to provoke it. I've owned a dog, and I now own two cats. While I see what you're saying, I don't think I could accept that behavior from either type of pet.
Well we warned people not to go near him, and anyone who voluntarily approached him we were unsympathetic to. We told everyone the worst horror stories so most people did avoid him.
Anyone he just walked up to and attacked got sympathy...
He did have good points, he could be one of the most affectionate cats. And he would always pretend to believe that whatever you were reaching for you really wanted his nose. And he mellowed as he got older - pretty much stopping just walking into a room full of people and going for the weakest, and only attacking if you actually did something to annoy him.
But when he did attack it was awful. He could wrap himself around you and bite and scratch until you could fight him off.
If he had been a dog we would have done everything possible to correct the behaviour, but if he had not been capable of learning we would probably have had him euthanised. That is partly of course any dog would have been stronger and bigger and therefore more dangerous.
My father once lost his temper and bit him back. I think this genuinely hurt my father more, as he obviously made sure he didn't hurt the cat and he must have tasted pretty bad. Strangely enough this didn't stop him biting people.
Victoria J
-------------------- Post accompanied by maniacal laughter. Posts: 577 | From: London, UK | Registered: Sep 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Cervus: I've worked at a vet clinic for 1.5 years and have never heard of this. Our vets have never mentioned it, and usually at least one staff member gets bitten and/or badly scratched on a daily basis. Currently I've got several 3" long claw marks on my arm. I sometimes clean my wounds with hydrogen peroxide but no one has ever treated bites or scratches as anything serious. Certainly no one on our current staff has ever gotten antibiotics for them. We're not even required to get any vaccinations or tetanus shots while working there...which probably says a lot about our boss's concern for personal safety.
Veterinary staff must get bitten on the hands frequently -- do the wounds swell? My finger was swollen to the point of immobility for several days. Hand wounds in general swell more than wounds on other parts of the body.
I suppose after frequent bites one might become immune to the bacteria. I don't think anyone's suggesting antibiotics for scratches, just for serious bites -- skin broken, deep puncture wounds.
-------------------- How homophobic do you have to be to have penguin gaydar? - Lewis Black Posts: 8322 | From: Columbus, OH | Registered: Aug 2005
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quote:Originally posted by piper: I'm hoping you mean that you were unsympathetic to those who messed with a mean cat after being warned, as opposed to those who just entered the house and did nothing to provoke it. I've owned a dog, and I now own two cats. While I see what you're saying, I don't think I could accept that behavior from either type of pet.
Well we warned people not to go near him, and anyone who voluntarily approached him we were unsympathetic to. We told everyone the worst horror stories so most people did avoid him.
My brother had a cat kind of like that. Pete was found in a dumpster about 4 days old. He was the only one of four kittens to survive. He thought my brother was god and everyone else, the enemy. He was a feisty kitten who grew into a feisty cat. My brother was about 22 when he found Pete. He and his friends were big active guys. Brother's rule was, if Pete goes after you for no reason, he gets punished. But he's a biter and a fighter. If you give the cat shit, expect to get bit. Even when Pete, brother, and I shared a house, I knew better than to pet Pete unless he was very obviously wanting me to. RIP Pete, 1990-2005; you truely were an alley cat.
Posts: 4811 | From: Austin, TX | Registered: Feb 2000
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posted
having been a professional feline behaviorist for over 20 years, I've handled many hundreds of cats, and been bitten by several. two bites in particular were the worst: on one, the cat's jaw hooked around my forearm, both upper and lower canines caught behind the bone. very bad, very painful, but immediate AB treatment kept it from becoming infected.
the second bite - different cat - punctured the lower joint on my thumb. it infected almost immediately, and it took IV antibiotics, oral ABs, immobilizing my hand in a brace, and complete inactivity to keep me from losing my thumb. that joint is still obviously deformed.
both cats were pets that were being groomed, and both were wearing specially designed nylon muzzles.
I've been bitten by dogs about the same number of times; none became infected, nor required anything more than soap and water washing of the wound.
handling cats can be very dangerous. some pet groomers will not do cats for that reason.
-------------------- "pardon me, I swallowed down the wrong throat." Posts: 27 | From: Albuquerque, New Mexico | Registered: Aug 2005
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posted
i'm a registered nurse and have taken care of many patients with cat bites. they frequently get cellulitis and infection, due to the pasteurella in the cats mouths. i was bitten by my precious little cat, "clee", a week before my daughter's wedding. within 6 hours, my arm swelled up to twice its size. as a nurse, there was no way i was going to a doctor. i just sent one of my kids over the border to mexico and had them buy a bottle of cefalexin--i was cured within hours!!!!
-------------------- "this is the best costume for the day"-----Little Edie--"Grey Gardens"--1976 Posts: 4 | From: El Paso, Texas | Registered: Feb 2006
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quote:Originally posted by hellpaso: as a nurse, there was no way i was going to a doctor.
That's an interesting statement. Can you clarify that for me -- what is it about being a nurse that made you not want to go to a doctor? I'm just curious -- plus, I don't live anywhere near the Mexican border, and I'm wondering if I should take some other precautions to avoid doctors.
-------------------- How homophobic do you have to be to have penguin gaydar? - Lewis Black Posts: 8322 | From: Columbus, OH | Registered: Aug 2005
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quote:Originally posted by hellpaso: i'm a registered nurse and have taken care of many patients with cat bites. they frequently get cellulitis and infection, due to the pasteurella in the cats mouths. i was bitten by my precious little cat, "clee", a week before my daughter's wedding. within 6 hours, my arm swelled up to twice its size. as a nurse, there was no way i was going to a doctor. i just sent one of my kids over the border to mexico and had them buy a bottle of cefalexin--i was cured within hours!!!!
I am a nurse as well. I certainly advocate self-treatment whenever safe and practical. However, I think that this statement is unbecoming of a professional nurse. Like it or not, nurses nave a duty to educate, and to make a statement like this in a public forum is rather irresponsible. I hope you don't regularly send your patients over the border for questionable, OTC medication purchases.
-------------------- You fail to consider, for such is the tyranny of fashion, that the swan is not a slim animal... -Jincy Kornhauser, Melinda Falling Posts: 1762 | From: Charleston, West Virginia | Registered: Jul 2005
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posted
At the shelter, cat bites became infected a lot more than dog bites. I have a finger that was partially paralyzed for a couple years, and still is a little stiff, due to a cat bite -- part of it was because it got me in one of my joints. An hour after it happened I was receiving IV antibiotics.
One time I walked into the laundry room of the shelter, and there was a kitten asleep on a stack of towels -- just adorable. I'd assumed it had escaped from a cage, so I reached for it -- and it nailed me! Yep, apparently it was just one of the feral cats/kittens in the neighborhood, and had wandered in through the open garage door, and found warm towels. Anyhow, even the little things can do damage.
posted
I've never really had an infection problem with cat bites/scratches (and I've had quite a few!), but was chatting with my oldest daughter the other day, and we think there's is *something* in their claws or mouths, because if the bite or scratch goes deep enough to bleed, it scars. I have one right now on teh side of my face- Shadow was flopped over my shoulder the other day, when my roommate got home (he can hear her car before I do). He scrambled around abruptly and jumped off, giving me a 2" long scratch just to one side of the corner of my mouth. It bled- a lot- I had to put a compress on it to stop the bleeding. That was... 10 days ago, the scab is nearly gone, and guess what! A pretty pink scar! (Too bad it wasn't on my forehead, eh?) And that's after smearing Vit E, Tea Tree Oil, confrey salve, Neosporin, etc on it. Just about everything but Drano went on it.
Oh well- my fiance says I should say it was an old duelling scar and act very secretive about it.
-------------------- "The test of our progress is not whether we add to the abundance of those who have much. It is whether we provide enough to those who have little." Franklin Delano Roosevelt Posts: 105 | From: Portland, Oregon | Registered: Jan 2006
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posted
The something in their mouths is a bacterium called Pasturella. Scratches are jagged wounds, not neat lacerations, which makes them more likely to scar.
I've had many "bites" over the years, but the one that recently sent me to the ER was the first bite. Those other "bites" were nips.
Fangs sunk deep into your flesh = bite.
-------------------- How homophobic do you have to be to have penguin gaydar? - Lewis Black Posts: 8322 | From: Columbus, OH | Registered: Aug 2005
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posted
I'm thinking a lot of it has to do with the sharpness of their teeth. Dogs have pointed teeth, but simply not as sharp. When cats bite it seems almost like needles, and possibly delivers the germs deeper.
posted
As someone who's worked in a cat shelter: cat's mouths are full of bacteria, and they're claws are covered in germs from their litter-box. The sharpness does drive the germs deeper, but can also result in puncture wounds. And cat scratches are like dipping your cut in a litter-box. And Lainie is correct about the scarring.
-------------------- "I saw weird stuff in that place last night. Weird, strange, sick, twisted, eerie, godless, EVIL stuff... and I want in."- Homer Simpson Posts: 2161 | From: Delaware | Registered: Aug 2005
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posted
a lot of it has to do with a cat bite versus a punction wound... if it nips you, you might be ok, but if the cat really sinks its teeth in, as mine did, you have to have a tetnis shot and be on a series on antibiotics, the sooner you see a doctor the better... if the wound gets red, puffy and sensitive to the touch (more so than a "normal" cut) go to the doctor or hospital... if the bite is deep enough, you can get blood poisioning... also, cat scratch fever isn't just a song...
erica
Posts: 2 | From: Buffalo, NY | Registered: Mar 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Cervus: I sometimes clean my wounds with hydrogen peroxide but no one has ever treated bites or scratches as anything serious.
Believe it or not, Hydrogen Peroxide is actually a very poor disinfectant, at least on living tissue. Oxygen in many forms is quite toxic to cells/tissue so your cells have various enzymes that convert that dangerous oxygen into Hydrogen Peroxide by combining the O2 with H2 for H2O2, your cells then take this Hydrogen Peroxide and depending on the enzyme convert it to either 2 H20 (water) and safer form O2 (oxygen) or 2 H2O (water).
So when you pour hydrogen peroxide into an open wound it is just as toxic to your cells as it is the bacterial cells, forunately your cells have enzymes to neutralize it. Which is what you are seeing when you see it bubble in a wound. That is your own cells turning that Hydrogen Peroxide into water and oxygen (with the Oxygen bubbling out.) So generally within a matter of seconds (or less) your cells have rendered that hydrogen peroxide useless.
Here is straight from the microbiology book...
"Hydrogen Peroxide is an antiseptic found in many household medicine cabinets and hospital supply rooms. It is not a good antiseptic for open wounds, in fact it may slow wound healing. It is quickly broken down to water and gaseous oxygen by the action of the enzyme catalase, which is present in human cells. However, hydrogen peroxide does effectively disinfect inanimate objects, aan application in which it is even sporicidal, especially at elevated temperatures. On a nonliving surface, the normally protective enzymes of aerobic bacteria and faculatative anaerobes are overwhelmed by the high concentrations of peroxide used."
So while it works well at cleaning up blood etc. spilled on surfaces, it really doesn't do much to disinfect a wound (other than its washing action of pouring in on.)
I have 2 cats and have been scratched countless times and bitten a few times and have never had any problems. Normally I will just clean out the wound with soap and water and use an antibiotic ointment if it is particually deep/large.
The reason some people may have an alergic reaction to a cat bite (not related to a serious infection) is that when people are alergic to cats, they are not alergic to cat hair but the cat's saliva that is on the hair from them bathing themselves. So you can imagine how much worse the reaction would be if that person were now bit by a cat and the saliva got directly into the skin.
Bunion
-------------------- You get more of what you want with a kind word and a gun then you do with a kind word alone. Posts: 44 | From: Columbia, SC | Registered: Mar 2006
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