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Author Topic: Self image discussion
guruwan2b
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


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At my thinnest (in high school) I weighed 118 and wore a size 9 jean. Never got below a size 9. Damn hips....
Now I would be happy with a size 16...

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Too much of this navel gazing and we'll disappear up our own arses.
Danvers Carew

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BeachLife
The Bills of St. Mary's


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I think charm and confidence go alot farther than just good looks. There will always be some people, both men and women, who don't see past beauty, but the majority of us look for some depth.

Not to say that sometimes youth and beauty don't open help. I'll admit a little attention from a beautiful women can go a long way with me, but I'm not going to go home with her and hang drywall over it.

For my own part, I've found that being charming, and friendly (with a touch of aloofness) goes a very long way in my daily interactions with people.

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Wisdom comes with age, but sometimes age comes alone.
Jack Dragon, On Being a Dragon
Confessions of a Dragon's scribe
Diary of my Heart Surgery

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Morrigan
Happy Holly Days


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quote:
Originally posted by ThistleSmelt:
Morrigan, how funny, those are my statistics pretty much and I feel I'm at an almost ideal weight. I could lose 5-10 pounds but it's not urgent. I assume we're built very differently- I will never have slender hips or legs no matter how much weight I lose. My pants size ranges from 8-12 depending on manufacturer.

I've got pretty broad shoulders (I never look right in a strapless dress) and pretty broad hips. When I get down to the 120ish area, I have that "perfect" hourglass figure. As is, I have a chest, a waist and hips. Can't ask for much more! And the size 10 is because it's my waist that expanded-the rest of the pants fit fine around my legs! (Yep-I've got a little gut-but I like it!)

Ryda, you feel fat if you reach a size 10? You know, I've heard that size 14 is the average size, so I don't see why you feel fat. Especially if you're 5'10".

Morrigan

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"The woods are lovely, dark and deep. But I have promises to keep, And miles to go before I sleep, And miles to go before I sleep." Robert Frost, Stopping by the Woods on a Snowy Evening

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TurquoiseGirl
The "Was on Sale" Song


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quote:
Originally posted by guruwan2b:
At my thinnest (in high school) I weighed 118 and wore a size 9 jean. Never got below a size 9. Damn hips....
Now I would be happy with a size 16...

I weighed 110 in high school and never got below a 9 for the same reason. Then someone introduced me to "misses" sizes which were more accomodating. I went through high school certain I was this behemouth, because I felt that at 5'2", I should be wearing a size 5. And so began the bulumia...

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There are people who drive really nice cars who feel that [those] cars won't be as special if other people drive them too. Where I come from, we call those people "selfish self-satisfied gits." -Chloe

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Spam & Cookies-mmm
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


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quote:
Originally posted by TurquoiseGirl:

Every time I do home improvement, like over the weekend, and I am having a hard time, I am very sure that I would not be doing this stuff on my own (or at all) if I was actually beautiful. You know, I would be going into Lowe's or Home Depot and all sorts of guys would be falling over themselves to come help me.

It doesn't help to know that when I was younger and thinner, guys would stop to help me if I was parked with my car hood up or looking confused in the parts department. Now they just drive right by.

How's my self image? As long as I'm not thinking about it, I think I'm pretty and thin. And funny. Then I'll catch sight of the fat woman in the mirror and the jokes I just told replay in my head as pathetic and lame.

In other words, as long as I avoid mirrors and automotive problems, I'm fine.

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Ryda Wong, EBfCo.
It Came Upon a Midnight Clearance


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quote:
Originally posted by Morrigan:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by ThistleSmelt:
[qb] Ryda, you feel fat if you reach a size 10? You know, I've heard that size 14 is the average size, so I don't see why you feel fat. Especially if you're 5'10".

Because I've held at 110 lbs and a size two for over a year. I started anorexia before I had my first period (and I was a regular-sized kid). Therefore, fat to me feels strange. Also, because I've spent a life running from normality and averages, and pushing myself to be something I'm not. My mom's side of the family is obsessed with appearance (at twelve she told me that if I didn't watch my thighs, I'd never find a husband. And she and her sister and my niece used to do full critiques of women when they walked into church, head to toe, everything). And that darned body dismorphia really screws things up.

Sometimes, I catch as reflection for a second that looks fine. I realize it's me, and it's different when I look back. It's a distorted view of reality. And, by this point it time, it's so deeply rooted, it's not going to go away. Not ever. It's as much a part of me as my love of dogs or my inability to sit with my feet on the floor. It's just part of my subjective and strange reality.

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So many spankings! It feels so good! But at the same time, I don't care about meeting your family! - I'mNotDedalus:

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Lainie
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


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quote:
Originally posted by Spam & Cookies-mmmm:
How's my self image? As long as I'm not thinking about it, I think I'm pretty and thin. And funny. Then I'll catch sight of the fat woman in the mirror and the jokes I just told replay in my head as pathetic and lame.

Yes, oh yes. The image I see in the mirror, shop windows, photos, is an unpleasant surprise every time -- even though I've been this big for about 15 years, and haven't been at my thinnest weight in more than 20.

But I do look prettier in my bathroom mirror than in the one in the restroom at work.

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How homophobic do you have to be to have penguin gaydar? - Lewis Black

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GenYus
Away in a Manager's Special


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For some reasons, I can fool myself in mirrors and reflective surfaces. It is photos that bring me back to the sad reality.

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IIRC, it wasn't the shoe bomber's loud prayers that sparked the takedown by the other passengers; it was that he was trying to light his shoe on fire. Very, very different. Canuckistan

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Spam & Cookies-mmm
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


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quote:
Originally posted by GenYus:
For some reasons, I can fool myself in mirrors and reflective surfaces. It is photos that bring me back to the sad reality.

If I deliberately look in the mirror, I can "fool myself" too. It's when the mirror catches me by surprise that the reality hits.

ETA: I just noticed my own sig line. Mr Isaacs summed it up nicely.

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The Goof
Deck the Malls


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quote:
No one is perfect
I'm not perfect?

[Roll Eyes]

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"It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid,than to open it and remove all doubt."- Mark Twain

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Morrigan
Happy Holly Days


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quote:
Originally posted by Ryda Wong:
Because I've held at 110 lbs and a size two for over a year. I started anorexia before I had my first period (and I was a regular-sized kid). Therefore, fat to me feels strange. Also, because I've spent a life running from normality and averages, and pushing myself to be something I'm not. My mom's side of the family is obsessed with appearance (at twelve she told me that if I didn't watch my thighs, I'd never find a husband. And she and her sister and my niece used to do full critiques of women when they walked into church, head to toe, everything). And that darned body dismorphia really screws things up.

Sometimes, I catch as reflection for a second that looks fine. I realize it's me, and it's different when I look back. It's a distorted view of reality. And, by this point it time, it's so deeply rooted, it's not going to go away. Not ever. It's as much a part of me as my love of dogs or my inability to sit with my feet on the floor. It's just part of my subjective and strange reality.

Ah. That's understandable. I used to feel fat (and I sometimes still do) sometimes when I look at myself (my body, not my face) in the mirror. Of course, when my aunt told me one time (when I had had two cups of hot chocolate) that if I didn't watch what I was eating, I would turn out fat, like my mom. (My mother's only a size 14. My aunt's a size 4.) And when my grandmother mentions how I've gained weight by mentioning my (nonexistant) double chin.

Each to their own.

Morrigan

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"The woods are lovely, dark and deep. But I have promises to keep, And miles to go before I sleep, And miles to go before I sleep." Robert Frost, Stopping by the Woods on a Snowy Evening

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Algae
Happy Xmas (Warranty Is Over)


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This has been an interesting discussion to read.

I've never been perfectly happy with my body. I was never super skinny - I'm just not built that way. I have boobs. I have hips. I have a short torso. The fashions that were popular when I was in high school didn't look good on me. And, especially judging by comments others have made, high school seems to be the root of our self-image for the rest of our lives.

I started feeling good in college. Heck, I took a pretty tiny bikini with me on my honeymoon! (But since we went to Disney World, I don't think I wore it more than once. [lol] )

But, since I've been pregnant and now the resulting shifts have happened, I'm back to hating my body. I'm 5'6" and about 145 pounds. I really could stand to lose 10 pounds, but I don't seem to want to do anything to make that happen. I nursed the Plankton, so my breasts have changed sizes and now they're all floppy. My stomach, which has always been a bit of a pot-belly, is now a flabby, stretch-marked mess. My thighs have also done something strange.

So, my self-image is screwed up right now. I don't see a ton of beauty in me. I did find this website, The Shape of Motherhood, though. Believe it or not, it is helping me to realize that other woman do have the same flabby tummy and the stretch marks that will probably never go away.

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Alcohol and calculus don't mix. Don't drink and derive!

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Gale
Let There Be PCs on Earth


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I come from a family that puts a great deal into appearance. Better to be stupid than fat. Considering how my grandmother told me how models lose weight when I was 12 ("just stick your finger down your throat or take laxatives"), I'm better than I have any right to be. According to certain members of my family, all my problems would be cured if I lost weight: eye sight, singleness, hangnails. Honestly.
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Ryda Wong, EBfCo.
It Came Upon a Midnight Clearance


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quote:
Originally posted by Gale:
According to certain members of my family, all my problems would be cured if I lost weight: eye sight, singleness, hangnails. Honestly.

In mine, life ain't worth livin' if you ain't skinny and made-up (well, and married and breedin). To them, all those things go hand-in-hand. You stay skinny and made-up to get a man, to get pregnant, and have to remain that way to bribe him into staying.

A.) I don't want to give birth.

and

B.) Any man that finds my physical that important isn't appreciating me as a person. He may exit the premisis and never return.

However, that doesn't change the running internal criticism.

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So many spankings! It feels so good! But at the same time, I don't care about meeting your family! - I'mNotDedalus:

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Salamander
Happy Xmas (Warranty Is Over)


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Well, I've improved a lot from the mental place where I used to be...

Strangely enough, I can recognise I actually look kinda good, but only about 10 years later. I look back at the photos of myself as a late teen or from my early 20's and think "Hey, I looked okay back then... shame I didn't know it at the time. Oh well, I missed my chance -- I'm pretty average now."

I've never been super critical of my physical appearance (although I have a long list of things I'd like to change if such things were possible). I have been exceedingly critical of my personality though. I'm typically shy around people (not that you'd probably know it from the way I carry on here) and social interaction is just something that doesn't come naturally. I have to actually remind myself to do things like say hello to people.

I did once come up with the idea for a unique marriage/relationship counselling service. My idea was that if a couple were having problems, the woman would become my partner and after no more than a few weeks she would go fleeing to her original partner and be very glad to be back.

If that's not low self esteem, I don't know what is!

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"victory thru self-deception"

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Lilybet
Xboxing Day


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This is a really good discussion - I have the internal "you're stupid, you're fat, you're ugly, you're boring, no one would ever want you" running from time to time but it seems like I've managed to take it waaaay down, the last couple of years.

Oddly, I think a lot of what happened to improve my self-image was that hellish company I worked for in Corpus. All the account managers were hot young chicks. I'm not quite that young, but somehow it seemed like it was catching. I used to joke that "fake it till you make it" would be a good company motto there, but in some ways that's what I did to improve self-image: just dressed and behaved as if I were a hottie, and what do you know, pretty much everybody buys it.

Obviously, that still leaves the problem of feeling that it's necessary to be a "hottie" to have worth as a person - which would be kind of nice to get away from. Sort of a matter of treating the symptom rather than the disease, maybe.

One of the worst things that ever happened to me, self-esteem-wise (and forgive me if this sounds familiar, I know I've told this story before) was when my now ex-father-in-law was first told I was pregnant by his son, whom I had not been dating very long. "I have to say I'm impressed at Garrick's taste," he told me. "You're not a real pretty girl - kind of funny-looking, in fact - and I'm glad he could see past that."

Stuck with me for YEARS. [Frown]

Still, I find that, at 37, and about 5'6" and somewhere around 160 pounds, I feel much more confident, sexier, and prettier than I did at 21 when I weighed around 130. And for whatever it's worth, I think I get a lot more male attention now than I did then. Not enough - but that's a whole nother story. Excuse me while I pop in and say hello at Rantidote.

TG, I'd be a bit leery of picking up the men who only fail to drop at your feet at Home Depot because you don't look helpless enough, anyway. Bet there's a reason they're hanging out in the power tools section, if you know what I mean (nudge nudge, wink wink).

Um. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

Lily "motion of the ocean" bet

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A day in the life: Human woman *** Frozen turkey

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TallGeekyGirl
O Read, O Read, The Manual


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I felt so bad about myself as a teen that thoughts of just ending it all were with me every day. Somewhere along the way I picked up the attitude that "if the world hates me so damn much I'm not going to give it the satisfaction of seeing me dead."

Twisted reasoning, perhaps, but it worked. For better or for worse, I am still here...

Still, self-doubt and low self-esteem are my constant companions. Nothing I am and nothing I do is ever good enough. Ever. I could cure cancer and within moments I'd probably find a reason to convince myself that I've somehow fallen short. Mediocrity, percieved or otherwise, is all I ever achieve.

I find myself unattractive. Too damn tall, too damn chubby, too damn homely... this is why, Troberg, I seem so awkward in my profile picture and my smile looks strained. I hate having my image documented for posterity. "Posterity" doesn't want to look at me. I don't like looking at myself. I even keep a very low-maintenance hairstyle so I don't have to spend too much time in front of a mirror. I wear little to no makeup because I figure it wouldn't do me any good anyway.

I am completely mystified as who why my SO has been with me for so long. There has to be some good points about me or he'd have headed for the high country like all my other relationships, but I'll be damned if I can see what that good is.

Edit: And this attitude is what I am left with after 3 years of therapy on self-esteem issues. This is as good as it gets. You think this is bad? Go back in time and talk to me several years ago...

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See, if I tell you about it, it won't be a mystery. It'll just be a fact, an ugly, moist fact, squatting on your brain like an octopus. And you don't want an octopus squatting on your brain, do you, son? -- Stan Smith, American Dad

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NeeCD
Happy Holly Days


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I'm not sure where my self-esteem is. Sometimes I look in the mirror and think "hey, I look pretty good" and sometimes I think "I look like a schlump today". I'm not unhappy with my weight, although I could use some muscle tone. I consider myself average looking, and never believed it when some people called me attractive. I do know that my self image really improved when I finally came to the conclusion that I just wasn't my type.

Actually, while thinking about what I was going to type, I realized that I think my self image is pretty good now - at least compared to my younger days - and maybe more often good than poor (although I definitely have my 'blame myself for everything' days). I got braces on my teeth about a year ago, and I think they look kind of cute. When I was younger, they probably would have made me self-conscious all the time, and now it's just occasional, and usually an after-thought.

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I wondered why the Frisbee was getting bigger, then it hit me.
What does "Bookachow", "YOMANK!" and other lingo mean?

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RingKeeper
Markdown, the Herald Angels Sing


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I was a looker when I was younger and I got lots of attention because of my appearance. I always hated my thighs, so much that when hubby and I went on our honeymoon I hated to wear shorts. I look back at our videos now and wonder what I was worried about, I was so thin. A few years, three kids and a couple of pounds later I don't feel so confident, and I miss the days when I could walk into any store in the mall and find something that looked great on me.

I think the trick is not to look back at what I had when I was sixteen, or even twenty. I'm still in pretty good shape. Maybe I could stand to lose a pound or two but will that really make me happier? The only time I really get upset with my appearance is when I'm shopping. Besides that, I'm what you would call low maintenance. A t-shirt, jeans and sneakers is what I'm most comfortable in, and sometimes that's all it takes to feel good.

My MIL is 54 years old, tall and thin. She isn't as thin as she was years ago, but that's understandable. She is constantly talking about how fat she is, how much weight she has gained or has to lose, and what she can and can't eat. She has a horrible self image, although I sispect sometimes it is just to hear us say "you're beautiful!" If she wants to starve, and sending us pictures in her size small jeans makes her happy, fine. But I don't like her talking that way around my daughter. She is twelve and I don't want her thinking she has to starve herself or be pencil thin to be beautiful.

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There are just some things a dog can't explain to a monkey.

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TurquoiseGirl
The "Was on Sale" Song


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quote:
Originally posted by Lilybet:
This is a really good discussion - I have the
TG, I'd be a bit leery of picking up the men who only fail to drop at your feet at Home Depot because you don't look helpless enough, anyway. Bet there's a reason they're hanging out in the power tools section, if you know what I mean (nudge nudge, wink wink).

Um. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

You're right. I know you're right. Certainly anyone who would pick me up because I seemed helpless is not someone I would want. And then if they were a creep, the Boutros would bite them and that would be bad.

This is the ongoing dialog of my life, however. I am not helpless; I don't want to be seen as perpetually helpless; but sometimes I would like the luxury to be helpless when I want. Like when it comes to lifting 40 pound, 30 year old storm windows into place. I would be happy to not be helpless if, just once in awhile I got some gratitous help.

True story: One of the more delicate little things in a social group I was in got oodles of help trying to figure out what was wrong with the brakes on her car (my solution would have been to take the damn car to Pepboys, but whatevs). I mentioned that my windsheild wipers had stopped working and I suspected a fuse. One of the guys who had spent hours looking at the delicate little things' cars turned to me and said "Aw, don't worry! You'll figure it out. You're good at that stuff." [Mad] Yes, of course I will, but I wanted pity, not self-sufficiency just then!

Of course this is the same group where I could be wearing a cocktail dress and spike heals (as could my best friend) and be asked to help with heavy lifty while the delicate things wearing sweats would be exempt.

I guess that perhaps what I want, once in awhile, is some validation that competence, strength (both emotional and physical) and brains can be feminine. I don't usually want some knight on a white horse to come and save me. But it would be nice if one would come along and fight beside me once in awhile. [Smile]

And objectively, when I get the stupid messages out of my brain, I am not an unattractive person. Sometimes I'm downright gorgeous. Just some days I don't feel very feminine. And of course it bothers me that I buy into the cultural notion of femininity.

And Lilybet, what is this "fake it, til you make it" business. I think you are one of the hottest women I know, while still being elegant. And I mean that in a totally heterosexual sense. Seriously. I sometimes go shopping thinking 1. What would Lilybet wear? and 2. Can I possibly carry that off?

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There are people who drive really nice cars who feel that [those] cars won't be as special if other people drive them too. Where I come from, we call those people "selfish self-satisfied gits." -Chloe

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ali_marea
The "Was on Sale" Song


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Hmmm very interesting stuff to read here.

My face is not unattractive. It's not extra beautiful, but it's unusual and attractive in its own way. I do hate my nose, but I'd never in a billion years have surgery on it or anything. That would be going way too far.

My weight, on the other hand, is a different story. I used to be very thin. In high school I was perfect. I had no idea, though. All I cared about was that my boobs were huge and people in my family teased me about it. So I wore gigantic shirts to cover them up.

Eventually I gained weight from having a sedentary job. Then I got out of an abusive relationship where I was told how much I was allowed to eat, etc. I gained more weight sort of as rebellion from that. 5 years later, I'm 9 months post-partum and very overweight. I hate it. I feel horrible. My health isn't great because of it.

Losing weight absolutely would make a positive difference. I'd be healthier, I'd feel healthier, and I could do more things and I could do them more easily.

So I'm trying to get a plan together to eat better and start exercising. Because I can't live like this my entire life. If I did, I'd be miserable.

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28 days, 6 hours, 42 minutes, and 12 seconds. That is when the world will end.

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Lainie
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


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I've often wondered if I would have maintained the much-slimmer figure I had in my younger days if I had really known how good I looked. My self-image was bad even then. I think that dynamic can lead one into apathy and overeating just as easily as it can lead one into anorexia or bulimia or compulsive exercise.

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How homophobic do you have to be to have penguin gaydar? - Lewis Black

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Lilybet
Xboxing Day


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quote:
Originally posted by TurquoiseGirl:
I guess that perhaps what I want, once in awhile, is some validation that competence, strength (both emotional and physical) and brains can be feminine. I don't usually want some knight on a white horse to come and save me. But it would be nice if one would come along and fight beside me once in awhile. [Smile]

Ah, I gotcha. I'd be pissed too at automatically being assumed to be "the lifter." I'd also be pissed - and more so - at always being assumed not to be capable of doing things for myself, but balance is good. And ITA that competence is, and absolutely should be more widely considered, a perfectly feminine trait. You don't still hang with that crowd, do you? I've known a lot of people who have the attitude that you describe, but it seems like lately I've been privileged to belong to a particularly healthy social set.

(Sigh) I have a feeling it's going to get more complicated, though. I'm coming on the market myself within the next few months, I think - to put it crudely - and on the one hand, I haven't *really* been in a relationship for so long that I'm dying to be in one again, but on the other, I feel like I have so many self-esteem and other issues to work through that I'll never be ready.

Thank you so much for saying such lovely things. Let's go shopping. [Big Grin]

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A day in the life: Human woman *** Frozen turkey

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Towknie
We Three Blings


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Hello,

Just randomly dropping in this thread here. It saddens me to see so much internal conflict going on over people's perception of themselves. Thought I'd liven it up a little and let you know that I think

SNOPES WOMEN ARE HOTTIES!!

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Towknie: Ryda-certified as wonderful, enlighted, and rational.

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Morrigan
Happy Holly Days


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*snickers* Thanks, Towknie!

I'm not sure if I qualify as a hottie, but it definately brightened my night! Thanks!

Morrigan

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"The woods are lovely, dark and deep. But I have promises to keep, And miles to go before I sleep, And miles to go before I sleep." Robert Frost, Stopping by the Woods on a Snowy Evening

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snapdragonfly
Happy Xmas (Warranty Is Over)


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Very interesting thread.

I had all the teenage angst and OMG I'm so ugly drama of most teenagers - even though I never heard anyone say anything to me to that effect and to judge from what guys told me, I was good looking.

But I wanted to look like Phoebe Cates.

Also, I take TERRIBLE photographs - my chin always looks gigantic! ~ so I would torture myself over unfortunate photos, and I took plenty of those.

And of course I thought I was fat. hah! haha!

I came to realize a couple decades ago I was considered good looking by most people even if I didn't think so. *shrug*

I actually am confident enough that I will frequently go out and about wearing almost no makeup and really scruffy clothes and pretty much no hair style. I certainly don't look my best that way, but, I just don't want to spend half an hour on my face every morning.

~now when it comes to a special occasion I like to put on the dogs and transform myself.

Nowadays there's really about 20 pounds that I wish could go away as easily as I can put on the makeup. But, when I look around at all the other bodies in real life, I realize that most of us in our 40's just don't look like we did in our 20's.

I keep thinking I'll lose that weight.

What I'd like to do really is get very disciplined about yoga, and focus on a flexible, healthy, youthful body rather than a "thin" one. Not that my butt or hips were ever thin. If I were my perfect weight and worked out I'd have a J Lo ass. As it is, imagine J Lo with an extra *mumble* pounds and rather more "fluffy" and that's me. Fortunately, my husband's eyes seem to be going and he thinks I look great.

And as he says, it's performance that counts anyway.

I'm glad I'm over worrying about my looks so much - I have so many other things to worry about these days. I mean, I am what I am, and it's only going to go downhill from here...I will never have a better body than I do today, unfortunately, so I might as well enjoy it while I can. It is what it is.

(and pretty is as pretty does...I tell my daughter, who is stunningly beautiful, so all the time...nobody likes a pretty bitch. Nobody that isn't screwed up, that is.)

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"Wolves, dragons and vampires, man. Draw the nut-bars like big ol' nut-bar magnets." ~evilrabbit

(snurched because one of my nutbar family members is all about wolves and another one is all about dragons...)(with apologies to surfcitydogdad)

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Llewtrah
Happy Xmas (Warranty Is Over)


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Townkie - where I am a "hottie" is a hot water bottle [Smile] maybe that's why b/f likes snuggling up to me? (chuckles)

For a while I thought my lack of self image went hand-in-hand with poor self-esteem . I got a self help book and found I didn't fit that description at all. If I do have poor self-esteem (and I get the feeling that my self-esteem is almost as absent as my self-image) then I've turned it into a motivating factor rather than a negative.

The self-esteem book asked things like whether I "felt good" or "felt bad" about myself in certain respects. But what about those of us who feel neither good nor bad? Or who simply don't feel anything? I concluded that I just "am" and whether the rest of the world likes me as I am is pretty much up to the rest of the world. I do my best to be a good person and cause no harm or upset to others, but I feel no need to prove anything to the world.

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Messybeast Cat Resource Archive
Llewtrah's Soapbox

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ThistleSoftware
Little Sales Drummer Boy


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TGirl- while I get what you're saying about not always being the lifter, that attitude also cuts the other way. Always being assumed to be too small or weak to lift heavy things, or throw a decent punch, or drive stick shift for god's sake, really gets old. I think all of my current male friends have been disabused of the notion that I need their help, but man does it raise my hackles when people are surprised that I can change the bottle on the water cooler myself.

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Officially Heartless

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Cold DecEmbra Brings The Sleet
Angels Wii Have Heard on High


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Dating fears skew our judgment, apparently...

I feel some affinity with Llewtrah's description of non-self-image - although I'm actually quite vain (in that I will usually sneak a look at myself in a shop window or available mirror), I absolutely will not spend more than 10 minutes sorting myself out for the day, and I don't think I've ever repaired to the Ladies' to powder my nose.

Weight has never really formed part of the framework of my self-image anyway: although I've weighed between 10 and 14 stone at various times (currently 13, but I'm TALL and I'm PREGNANT, so apparently it's allowed [Big Grin] ), it was always, always about my spotty face, coke-bottle specs, and braces. Once those were done away with, I really did think I was pretty gorgeous. I think I've just now normalised after that episode!

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I want you to lay down your life, Perkins. We need a futile gesture at this stage. It will raise the whole tone of the war.

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Morrigan
Happy Holly Days


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quote:
Originally posted by ThistleSmelt:
TGirl- while I get what you're saying about not always being the lifter, that attitude also cuts the other way. Always being assumed to be too small or weak to lift heavy things, or throw a decent punch, or drive stick shift for god's sake, really gets old. I think all of my current male friends have been disabused of the notion that I need their help, but man does it raise my hackles when people are surprised that I can change the bottle on the water cooler myself.

I completely agree. When I was a trucker, I always had men surprised that I could "drive that big thing" and they always assumed that I was just there to be his company. When I had to help the ex load the trailer, I had guys (men, always) take loading bars and straps out of my hands, literally, out of my hands, because, presumably, I didn't know how to do it. One incident that sticks out was when I was asking the ex how to get back there (it was behind some boxes, and I had to secure a strap back there). One of the guys from the place we were loading at took the strap from me (well, tried. I didn't let go) and started to tell me how to get it into the E-track. I snarkily replied "I know how to secure it. I was asking how to get back there without damaging anything." The ex then told him to let me do it, and that I'm the one that usually does that stuff.

For me, when people assume I can't do something, such as lift heavy stuff, even when they find out that I'm going to be a cop, just makes me pissed off and want to prove them wron. It kind of ups my self-image, because I usually then think that I'm better then they are. Though, YMMV.

Morrigan

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"The woods are lovely, dark and deep. But I have promises to keep, And miles to go before I sleep, And miles to go before I sleep." Robert Frost, Stopping by the Woods on a Snowy Evening

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Monster Joe
I'm Dreaming of a White Sale


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I don't have a problem with my self image. I know I'm an ugly bugger and couldn't care less.
My teeth make Austin Powers look like an ad for toothpaste, I've got a pot belly the size of a beer barrel and I'm covered in fur.
So what? I'm fairly intelligent, well-read and emotionally stable. That matters more to me.
Yet, whenever I mention I don't consider myself attractive, people are all over me. "You shouldn't say that", "Why do you hate yourself?", "Why do you have such low self esteem?"...

First off, I say it because I'm not some narcissistic fool but just plain realistic.
Secondly, I don't hate myself. There's a difference between hating yourself and being realistic about yourself. I hate most other people, but not myself.
Thirdly, I do not have low self esteem. If anything, I think I am better than most people. Which probably isn't a good thing either but that's another discussion.

And who decided skinny is beautiful? My SO has been overweight most of her life. It's because she likes to eat. Big deal. Her health is not at risk so whose business is it anyway? She learned to love herself for who she is, in spite of the snide remarks of the skinny brigade.

"Fat" or "overweight" do NOT equal "stupid" or "ugly". Why is that so hard to understand for most people?

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You're saying "Long Live Rock n Roll!" not "Let's go home and drink a beer"

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TurquoiseGirl
The "Was on Sale" Song


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quote:
Originally posted by Lilybet:
quote:
Originally posted by TurquoiseGirl:
I guess that perhaps what I want, once in awhile, is some validation that competence, strength (both emotional and physical) and brains can be feminine. I don't usually want some knight on a white horse to come and save me. But it would be nice if one would come along and fight beside me once in awhile. [Smile]

Ah, I gotcha. I'd be pissed too at automatically being assumed to be "the lifter." I'd also be pissed - and more so - at always being assumed not to be capable of doing things for myself, but balance is good. And ITA that competence is, and absolutely should be more widely considered, a perfectly feminine trait. You don't still hang with that crowd, do you? I've known a lot of people who have the attitude that you describe, but it seems like lately I've been privileged to belong to a particularly healthy social set.


No. They gave me the boot for not being "nuturing enough". Seems that in addition to doing the heavy lifting, I was expected to assuage the men's egos by listening to how women "didn't like nice men". All together a good thing, not hanging out with them anymore.


quote:

Thank you so much for saying such lovely things. Let's go shopping. [Big Grin]

Well, I meant them. Every one. And I would truly love to go shopping with you!

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There are people who drive really nice cars who feel that [those] cars won't be as special if other people drive them too. Where I come from, we call those people "selfish self-satisfied gits." -Chloe

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Hero_Mike
Happy Holly Days


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None of us, I think, are ever too enthralled with our own personalities. I mean, we spend all day with ourselves, and we happen to be privy to all of those dirty little secrets about ourselves - even the ones that we don't tell our best friends, lovers, or therapists.

So when we look at ourselves, figuratively, we don't see that nice smile or the thoughtful eyes or the cute ears. We see every lump and bump for what it is - imperfection. And for many of us, a sign of weakness.

I've gained nearly 40 pounds since the beginning of the year - or almost 20% of my weight in January. On two occasions, I gained about 10 pounds in a single month when I was travelling - once in April, and again in June. It's my own fault that it happened, because I didn't need to eat 3 cheeseburgers for lunch, but just one. Yes, I did a great job justifying it because I had just come back from being at 14000 feet altitude for a week and living on one can of chili a day because the local food has always made me sick. So yes, I blame myself. Always do. And the thing is that at the time, no amount of rational logic about the short and long-term health effects, the cost of new clothing, or the discomfort that this would cause me, could keep me from doing that. Perhaps because I felt sad, overworked, lonely, and unappreciated after coming back from said business trips.

My own poor self-image has been, sadly, reinforced by some nasty statements from people who I thought were really close to me. Back in 1988 I had a pen-pal whom I had just about fallen in love with. It seemed mutual too, until we met in person and she found that I looked nothing like what she had expected. This wasn't any deception on my part, except that a mutual acquaintance had shown her a picture of another guy named Mike. I have spent countless hours since then wondering "was I really that bad?". And while I would think today that some 17 year old girl was just being silly, petty, and shallow, it still wounded my own 17 year old soul. Perhaps permanently.

Self-image is an issue for many of us guys too. The above example seems worse because, well, it's a lot more personal than just being compared to, say, a supermodel, or the male equivalent.

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"The fate of *billions* depends on you! Hahahahaha....sorry." Lord Raiden - Mortal Kombat

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Em
Happy Holly Days


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quote:
Originally posted by Monster Joe:
She learned to love herself for who she is, in spite of the snide remarks of the skinny brigade.

"Thin" or "skinny" doesn't equal "snide superficial bitch", either. Why is that so hard to understand?

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What the NFBSK does YOMANK mean?

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Toys for big boys.
Deck the Malls


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I'm 56 pounds overweight for my height. I'm working on getting down to 98 pounds, because I'll feel happy when my weight is in double figures rather than triple.

I think I'll be more confident when I'm that thin.

Being a short, chubby, curly haired girl is not fun.

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I am not taking lectures on physics from a man in tights.

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