posted
My apologies for this seeming incredibly disjointed and ignorant. Also, this is all information coming from my dad. Right now, this is everything I know.
My little brother is 18 years old. Last year, he decided he wanted to be in the Marines so he found a recruiter and enlisted during his Senior year of high school. He was supposed to graduate a semester early (in January) and was supposed to "ship out" for California in either April or May (I can't really remember which one).
Apparently, (this is where the idiot part comes in) he failed 3 of his 4 required English classes in high school. He figured that they weren't really that strict on graduation requirements and they'd just let him graduate without those classes
He found a job somewhere as a welder for 19 dollars an hour and just dropped out of school. My dad (he's actually my stepbrother) literally MADE him get back into school at the beginning of summer. He's currently at a school that's made for people who didn't graduate only by a few classes and offers a high school diploma, not just a GED so he would at least have that.
In the last few months, he's gotten a girlfriend (he goes through them like underwear) who he seems to actually like, his own apartment and a job he enjoys. Long story short, he doesn't feel like being in the Marines anymore
Like I said, he was supposed to go to boot camp for the Marines at the beginning of the summer (IIRC), but since he didn't graduate he applied for some sort of "extension". According to my dad, his extension is up (my dad said he signed some papers contracting him into the Marines). Someone (i'm really not sure who - I would guess maybe his recruiter?) has been showing up at my brother's workplace, and apparently my brother has just been hiding from him/(them?).
I guess a couple of days ago "they" came in and told him that "they" would be back on Monday to take him to California - no matter what.
I asked my dad if there was anything he could do and he told me that he could get some sort of a "dishonorable discharge", but that was it. I said that if he were really stuck with this I would imagine that he'd be pinned with desertion or something like that, but I really honestly know very little about the military and how those things work.
Now, he can't get into the military at all no matter what without a diploma or GED, right? Why are they still tracking him down if he doesn't have one (and is thinking about dropping out of the "school" he's in now)?
I asked my dad if he could go into the reserves or some other part time type branch of the service since he wants to stick around here, but my dad insists that there aren't reserves in the Marines - just the Army and national Guard. I'm pretty sure my friend Matt is in the reserves though and I know he's in the Marines, so i'm pretty sure the reserves exist in the Marines
Basically, I'm just hoping for advice and/or answers.
Thanks!
ETA: My apologies for excessive use of parentheses.
-------------------- "I find them to be in contradiction of the basic principles of YOUR MOM!!!" -We've Got Mail Posts: 1361 | From: Muncie, IN | Registered: Sep 2005
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Other than that, all I can share is my own experience, observed of a friend. I had a youth group student a few years ago who was in danger of failing her senior year, and had early enlisted in the Army. We graduate in late June here, and around May when her recruiter found out she wasn't doing so well, he tried to talk her into dropping out of school and signing up at the community college for a one-month course. She said it wasn't a GED, it was called an AED or something, like an adult diploma. As it turned out, she didn't do that (I was so glad!!) but I think her recruiter had a little talk with one of her teachers. She magically completed the class she was in danger of failing, with the minimum passing grade.
Anyway, all that to say, I think they will work to come find you and make sure you're eligible to enter. I wish your brother the best of luck with whatever happens!
-------------------- I love dairy! Does that mean I can't be a vegan? Posts: 1569 | From: Upstate NY | Registered: Dec 2003
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I'm sure I'm preaching to the choir(unless your stepbrother is actually reading this), but of all the bad decisions your stepbrother has made so far, trying to avoid them and hoping it goes away is the worst (well, second worst after signing up prematurely in the first place).
I feel for you and your family though. I have a son who has dealt with things the same way. He's more responsible now, but he is dealing with a lot of adverse consequences left over from his previous head-in-the-sand technique for dealing with problems. I hope your stepbrother figures out soon that he needs to actively deal with this situation.
ETA: Going for the world record for most times using a form of the word "deal" in one post. Too early in the morning for me to form a well-written sentence!
-------------------- "But I'm adding this to my reasons why I never really liked really good looking men much. Sheesh, what good is good looking if you have to stuff a sock in his mouth." - Sara at home NFBSK, IIRC and other mysterious Snopester language Posts: 851 | From: Indiana | Registered: Dec 2004
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If your brother signed up under the DEP (delayed entrance program) while he was in high school he should have the option to back out with no reprecussions. The recruiter will probably make him feel really bad (and he should because he wasted a lot of the recruiters very valuable time).
If he signed up regular elistment then as far as I know he's stuck with it however if he's dead set against going he should probably speak to an attorney and find out his options.
Honestly thought the best thing he could do is live up to his obligations. He's young and girlfriends will come and go as do jobs. He sounds like the discipline and skills the marines will teach him would be ideal. Regardless of what he decides he needs to quit hiding from the recruiter or whoever is trying to track him down.
HTH, Beak
Posts: 7 | From: West Des Moines, Iowa | Registered: Jan 2006
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Well, I can't answer your question about whether a diploma or GED is required to get into the marines... but I knew someone in college who had made a similar "mistake" and claimed he was gay to get discharged. I think it may have been dishonorable discharge but I don't think at that point he cared.
Posts: 439 | From: Redondo Beach, CA | Registered: Sep 2005
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If your brother doesn't want to go into the marines anymore than he needs to consult a lawyer about his options. I have a feeling since he has never taken any steps beyond what sounds like a pretty preliminary one that he won't be compelled to join up, but he needs to do something about this now before it gets out of hand.
This is one of those reasons I have a fundamental dislike for any kind of recruiting program going on in high schools. Kids who aren't even allowed to vote are being told they can sign their lives away and that's just peachy?
-------------------- If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, it's just possible you haven't grasped the situation. - Jean Kerr Posts: 18428 | From: Ontario, Canada | Registered: Nov 2001
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He shouldn't have any legal issues not going if he did DEP, which it sounds like he did.
But if recruiters are showing up at his workplace, he needs to let them know that they need to not show up there any more.
-------------------- "When a stupid man is doing something he is ashamed of, he always declares that it is his duty."--George Bernard Shaw Posts: 19266 | From: Nashville, TN | Registered: Jun 2002
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quote:Originally posted by AnglRdr: He shouldn't have any legal issues not going if he did DEP, which it sounds like he did.
But if recruiters are showing up at his workplace, he needs to let them know that they need to not show up there any more.
That was my understanding, too. My son signed up on DEP in high-school, and he was given the opportunity to say "no" before he went to boot camp.
That being said, he'd be better off to stay out if possible, because it sounds like he might be heading for a dishonorable if he does go in. He definitely does not need that on his record. If nothing else, maybe he'll learn a life lesson from this experience.
Christie, I agree. While military service is, in my opinion, honorable and to be admired, a high-school person is too often not mature enough to make such a serious decision.
-------------------- "This air we're breathing. Oxygen, isn't it?"~I’mNotDedalus, impersonating Vincent D’Onofrio.|"Sometimes trying to communicate can be like walking through a minefield."~wanderwoman "Give people a break. It's not easy doing a life."~Joshua Halberstam Posts: 4020 | From: Oklahoma | Registered: Nov 2005
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quote: quote: ------------------------------------------------------------------------ My dad (he's actually my stepbrother) literally MADE him get back into school at the beginning of summer ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Your dad is your stepbrother??? ... how does that work?
Hey, it was 4:30 in the morning! (that's my excuse)
Thanks everyone for your advice. I asked my friend (who is in the reserves) about it and he told me that until he steps on that plane to California, he can get out of it. If that's true, i'm not sure why they're trying to track him down. As to what/how he signed up, i'm honestly not sure. I would assume it's like you said, Anglrider, because you know what you're talking about (and I obviously don't).
diehard in the dust, I read through your link and it sounds like he is *absolutely* not eligible because of not having his diploma. It says that you can get in "under certain circumustances" with a GED, but you've gotta have something.
Thanks everyone, I'll pass the information onto my dad.
-------------------- "I find them to be in contradiction of the basic principles of YOUR MOM!!!" -We've Got Mail Posts: 1361 | From: Muncie, IN | Registered: Sep 2005
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If the Marines want to take him to non-judicial punishment for unauthorized absence, the worst discharge he could face, barring an actual cout-martial, is an "Other than Honorable," which still is not nice. If the Marines do not want to waste any time on him, they could give him an "entry level seperation" which would just wash their hands of him. I enlisted in the Navy under DEP in 1984, and I did not have the option to say no once I took my oath.
-------------------- "SPECTRE's a dedicated fraternity whose strength lies in the absolute integrity of its members."
- Blofeld Posts: 186 | From: Safely back at my Norfolk, VA evil lair | Registered: Aug 2004
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quote: This is one of those reasons I have a fundamental dislike for any kind of recruiting program going on in high schools. Kids who aren't even allowed to vote are being told they can sign their lives away and that's just peachy?
Recruits under 18 are not allowed to enlist without written parental consent, so your statement is factually incorrect.
Anyhoo... SPECTRE's comment is absolutely correct. He could very well face, NJP, and an other than honorable discharge could have serious ramifications well into his future, should he ever try to apply for a civil service / government job, or try to work in any occupational field requiring a security clearance. That will follow him forever.
It is ultimately at the discretion of the Marine Corps as to whether they want to left him off the hook easy (as SPECTRE described), or go after him both barrels. The Corps' decision will depend entirely on how honest, forthright, and cooperative he is with them.
And right now, he is on the WRONG track. The last thing he needs to do is play games and piss off his recruiter... that can pretty much ensure that this will come to an ugly end. He needs to summon some intestinal fortitude, show some personal integrity and responsibility, and meet with his recruiter face to face to discuss this. That's his best hope of being released from this committment.
-------------------- High on the wind, the Highland drums begin to roll, and something from the past just comes and stares into my soul... --Mark Knopfler Posts: 3402 | From: New Bern, NC | Registered: May 2004
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quote: This is one of those reasons I have a fundamental dislike for any kind of recruiting program going on in high schools. Kids who aren't even allowed to vote are being told they can sign their lives away and that's just peachy?
Recruits under 18 are not allowed to enlist without written parental consent, so your statement is factually incorrect.
Not it's not "factually incorrect". Do recruiters target high school kids? Why yes, yes they do. Are most high school kids of voting age? Why, no, I don't believe they are.
Anyhoo kids should not be recruited in high school especially if they need mom's permission to join up. That's just wrong on so many levels.
-------------------- If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, it's just possible you haven't grasped the situation. - Jean Kerr Posts: 18428 | From: Ontario, Canada | Registered: Nov 2001
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Well, your statement was that children under 18 are being told they can sign their live away. That IS factually incorrect.
What they are told is that only Mom and Dad can sign their lives way... they don't have that power until they turn 18.
And believe me, when recruiters are doing their jobs, they're not just recruiting the young person... "recruiting the parents" is part and parcel of the job.
-------------------- High on the wind, the Highland drums begin to roll, and something from the past just comes and stares into my soul... --Mark Knopfler Posts: 3402 | From: New Bern, NC | Registered: May 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Christie: Do recruiters target high school kids? Why yes, yes they do. Are most high school kids of voting age? Why, no, I don't believe they are.
Anyhoo kids should not be recruited in high school especially if they need mom's permission to join up. That's just wrong on so many levels.
Specifically of what recruiters are you speaking, Christie? In Canada the only recruiters I know of who go into high schools are recruiters for the Royal Military College of Canada. I know the world has changed a bit in the 10 years since I was in that situation, but RMC was there along with other universities giving information about the educational opportunities. Have you ever actually attended one of the RMC recruitment sessions? It wasn't about "signing your life away" but rather about getting a top education at one of Canada's best universities (it's not easy to get into RMC) in exchange for a minimum of 2 years service.
-------------------- "You're the opposite of troll. It's a compliment!" Posts: 12086 | From: Alberta | Registered: Feb 2000
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Some other information pertaining to Canada: Recruits who are under the age of 18 do need parental permission and they are legally prohibited from being deployed anywhere until they reach the age of majority. Canada does not send 16 and 17 year olds off to fight (we just train them for it until they're legally adults). "Child soldiers" (16 and 17 year olds) may also request to leave the military service during their first year of enrollment, which is almost always granted, and the only penalty of which I'm aware is financial.
-------------------- "You're the opposite of troll. It's a compliment!" Posts: 12086 | From: Alberta | Registered: Feb 2000
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The CF will recruit in high schools. However, it is not our recruiting system that does it. It is the reserve units, who are responsible to identify their own potential recruits that do this.
The CF will also set up stands at career fairs that are usually put on by the various school districts.
Posts: 2064 | From: New Brunswick, Canada | Registered: Aug 2004
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quote:Originally posted by DesertRat: Well, your statement was that children under 18 are being told they can sign their live away. That IS factually incorrect.
What they are told is that only Mom and Dad can sign their lives way... they don't have that power until they turn 18.
And believe me, when recruiters are doing their jobs, they're not just recruiting the young person... "recruiting the parents" is part and parcel of the job.
But why? Seriously. Why do they need to recruit 17 yr olds? I really think they should not be allowed to actively target and recruit anyone who cannot legally decide for themselves that this is what they want to do with their lives. It would be so bad to tell the kid s/he needs to wait, at the very least until they are 18 before they commit to anything?
-------------------- If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, it's just possible you haven't grasped the situation. - Jean Kerr Posts: 18428 | From: Ontario, Canada | Registered: Nov 2001
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quote:Originally posted by UEL: The CF will recruit in high schools. However, it is not our recruiting system that does it. It is the reserve units, who are responsible to identify their own potential recruits that do this.
The CF will also set up stands at career fairs that are usually put on by the various school districts.
I guess they've changed their policy then as they were certainly recruiting in my high school in the 70s. This was a high school where we graduated out of grade 11 BTW so they were trying to get 15 & 16 yr olds to think about an army career. But, as far as I know none of were expected to sign up after mom signed a permission slip
-------------------- If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, it's just possible you haven't grasped the situation. - Jean Kerr Posts: 18428 | From: Ontario, Canada | Registered: Nov 2001
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My brother was recruited by a reserve unit thing when he was 17 in highschool. He went through with the application, and then they turned him down! He was devistated.
Last week they called back. Apparently they've changed their standards, and now whatever thing disqualified him before does not matter any more. So he's reapplied, and is waiting to hear.
I'm desperately hoping he gets in. I mean, on one hand I'm next door to being a pacifist, so I'm not excited about the army itself, but on the other hand, if there's anyone in more need than my brother of learning that kind discipline and responsibility, I'd hate to see it! And besides, if they turn him down again he'd be so sad.
-------------------- a moment for old friends now estranged, victims of the flux of alliances and changing perceptions. There was something there once, and that something is worth honoring as well. - John Carroll Posts: 3375 | From: Ontario, Canada | Registered: Mar 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Christie: Do recruiters target high school kids? Why yes, yes they do. Are most high school kids of voting age? Why, no, I don't believe they are.
Anyhoo kids should not be recruited in high school especially if they need mom's permission to join up. That's just wrong on so many levels.
Specifically of what recruiters are you speaking, Christie? In Canada the only recruiters I know of who go into high schools are recruiters for the Royal Military College of Canada.
Since the OP addressed a situation in the US, my response was to a US situation. We have had multiple threads with numerous links to stories about the recruiting practices of the US Army and they way they target high school students, including a few stories about recruiters who have stepped well over the line ethically.
-------------------- If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, it's just possible you haven't grasped the situation. - Jean Kerr Posts: 18428 | From: Ontario, Canada | Registered: Nov 2001
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quote:Originally posted by Christie: This was a high school where we graduated out of grade 11 BTW so they were trying to get 15 & 16 yr olds to think about an army career.
Is it that much different from any other career? We had tradespeople come to our school to try to get us (started around age 15) to think about being plumbers, mechanics, and electricians. We had professionals talk to us about being doctors, lawyers, and veterinarians. We did career aptitude tests and had to pick one of the choices that we found interesting and then research and do a written report on it, what we thought of it, and the feasibility of going into it. In grade 12 we had to choose a career preparation course and do a two week internship at an appropriate place.
High schools spend a fairly good amount of time trying to get the kids to think about all kinds of careers. A military career is just one of the many presented.
How do you feel about cadets? They start around age 13 in what is essentially a simulated career as a Reservist.
-------------------- "You're the opposite of troll. It's a compliment!" Posts: 12086 | From: Alberta | Registered: Feb 2000
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quote:Originally posted by Christie: This was a high school where we graduated out of grade 11 BTW so they were trying to get 15 & 16 yr olds to think about an army career.
Is it that much different from any other career? We had tradespeople come to our school to try to get us (started around age 15) to think about being plumbers, mechanics, and electricians. We had professionals talk to us about being doctors, lawyers, and veterinarians. We did career aptitude tests and had to pick one of the choices that we found interesting and then research and do a written report on it, what we thought of it, and the feasibility of going into it. In grade 12 we had to choose a career preparation course and do a two week internship at an appropriate place.
High schools spend a fairly good amount of time trying to get the kids to think about all kinds of careers. A military career is just one of the many presented.
How do you feel about cadets? They start around age 13 in what is essentially a simulated career as a Reservist.
Jenn, I thought the same thing. But then I realized that one of the major differences between career/college recruiters and armed forces recruiters is that you can opt out of career/college paths at any time, and you can't do that in the armed forces - you're stuck until you've met your commitment.
-------------------- "The little local company I buy from has CHEAP shipping and I have met their goats." (snapdragonfly)
"And that's one lost erection I'll never get back! You hear me Dan! I'm owed an erection!" (I'mNotDedalus) Posts: 2658 | From: California | Registered: Jul 2005
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quote: This is one of those reasons I have a fundamental dislike for any kind of recruiting program going on in high schools. Kids who aren't even allowed to vote are being told they can sign their lives away and that's just peachy?
Recruits under 18 are not allowed to enlist without written parental consent, so your statement is factually incorrect.
Anyhoo... SPECTRE's comment is absolutely correct. He could very well face, NJP, and an other than honorable discharge could have serious ramifications well into his future, should he ever try to apply for a civil service / government job, or try to work in any occupational field requiring a security clearance. That will follow him forever.
It is ultimately at the discretion of the Marine Corps as to whether they want to left him off the hook easy (as SPECTRE described), or go after him both barrels. The Corps' decision will depend entirely on how honest, forthright, and cooperative he is with them.
And right now, he is on the WRONG track. The last thing he needs to do is play games and piss off his recruiter... that can pretty much ensure that this will come to an ugly end. He needs to summon some intestinal fortitude, show some personal integrity and responsibility, and meet with his recruiter face to face to discuss this. That's his best hope of being released from this committment.
But there is no oath administered in DEP until, at the earliest, MEPS, which wouldn't be something he would do until shortly before he was supposed to go to boot camp.
Until and unless you have actually sworn an oath, you are not a member of the military, and are not punishable under the UCMJ (with some exceptions, of which this is not one).
-------------------- "When a stupid man is doing something he is ashamed of, he always declares that it is his duty."--George Bernard Shaw Posts: 19266 | From: Nashville, TN | Registered: Jun 2002
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Nope... nowadays, they usually send you to MEPS first chance they get. When I was in the DEP, they sent me to MEPS and I took the oath the weekend after I signed all the paperwork at the recruiter's office.
I suspect that is also what happened here.
Christie, I'm not blowing you off, I just have to run an errand, but I will respond to your query later on...
-------------------- High on the wind, the Highland drums begin to roll, and something from the past just comes and stares into my soul... --Mark Knopfler Posts: 3402 | From: New Bern, NC | Registered: May 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Christie: This was a high school where we graduated out of grade 11 BTW so they were trying to get 15 & 16 yr olds to think about an army career.
Is it that much different from any other career?
I think it is. Leaving aside the whole issue of going to war, young people who pursue the other careers you describe do not have the same legal obligations that a military recruit has. It's a lot easier to drop out of medical school or quit plumbing than it is to leave the military once you've taken your oath.
That said, I'm not sure recruiting a kid a few months before his 18th birthday is really that much different from recruiting him on or after his 18th birthday. And as wrong as a military career would have been for me, and would be for my daughter, I know it's the right path for some young people. I do believe in strict, and strictly enforced, ethical guidelines for all recruitment settings.
-------------------- How homophobic do you have to be to have penguin gaydar? - Lewis Black Posts: 8322 | From: Columbus, OH | Registered: Aug 2005
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quote:Originally posted by DesertRat: Nope... nowadays, they usually send you to MEPS first chance they get. When I was in the DEP, they sent me to MEPS and I took the oath the weekend after I signed all the paperwork at the recruiter's office.
Wow. That's not really delayed entry, then, is it? It's more like immediate entry and delayed service.
-------------------- How homophobic do you have to be to have penguin gaydar? - Lewis Black Posts: 8322 | From: Columbus, OH | Registered: Aug 2005
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Things have definitely changed, then. I did DEP in April, went to MEPS in early August, and went to boot camp in middle of August.
-------------------- "When a stupid man is doing something he is ashamed of, he always declares that it is his duty."--George Bernard Shaw Posts: 19266 | From: Nashville, TN | Registered: Jun 2002
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quote:Originally posted by Roadie: But then I realized that one of the major differences between career/college recruiters and armed forces recruiters is that you can opt out of career/college paths at any time, and you can't do that in the armed forces - you're stuck until you've met your commitment.
Yes, but it's a difference young people are made very aware of, aren't they? I don't know about the recruitment practices in the US, but in my experience of how it's done here they stress the legal commitment long before you (and parents) sign anything binding. Just as the plumbers, doctors, and everyone else explained the pros and cons of their jobs and the universities made clear that if you decided to drop out after a certain point that you don't get your money back, so did the Armed Forces.
All career paths have various commitments, good or bad, from spending a non-refundable $40,000 on a degree, years of student loans, to time commitments of the career itself. I'm not sure how 2-3 years of contractual services in the Armed Forces, which is not made secret by any stretch of the imagination, is truly all that different. It's just another thing to take into account.
And like I said, in Canada 16 and 17 year olds can opt out in their first year and they will not be deployed. As well, the Reserves have no minimum commitment.
-------------------- "You're the opposite of troll. It's a compliment!" Posts: 12086 | From: Alberta | Registered: Feb 2000
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quote:Originally posted by Christie: This was a high school where we graduated out of grade 11 BTW so they were trying to get 15 & 16 yr olds to think about an army career.
Is it that much different from any other career? We had tradespeople come to our school to try to get us (started around age 15) to think about being plumbers, mechanics, and electricians. We had professionals talk to us about being doctors, lawyers, and veterinarians. We did career aptitude tests and had to pick one of the choices that we found interesting and then research and do a written report on it, what we thought of it, and the feasibility of going into it. In grade 12 we had to choose a career preparation course and do a two week internship at an appropriate place.
High schools spend a fairly good amount of time trying to get the kids to think about all kinds of careers. A military career is just one of the many presented.
How do you feel about cadets? They start around age 13 in what is essentially a simulated career as a Reservist.
Thinking about the army as a career is something I have no problem with - many of my relatives are in the Armed Forces (you can't come from the Maritimes and not be able to say that I think!) but none of them joined up needing a signed permission slip from home. They joined as adults. That is my only issue here. I am not against the military as a career option. I agree with others though that to compare joining the Armed Forces with deciding you might like to go to law school is not even in the same ballpark -- unless a military recruit can back out anytime s/he wants to just because they realise it's a bad choice and they've changed their minds. Which clearly does not happen.
As to cadets or whatever, again, I have no problem with that - if that is what the kid wants. S/he is not committing themselves to anything at that point and can leave at any time.
-------------------- If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, it's just possible you haven't grasped the situation. - Jean Kerr Posts: 18428 | From: Ontario, Canada | Registered: Nov 2001
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When I was in high school in the late 90s the recruiters came to my school on career day along with representatives from many other fields. I guess you could consider this recruiting in the schools, but it wasn't like they were following you around and trying to chase you into a corner to get you to sign up. There were simply tables with representatives from the USAF, USA, USN, USMC, and USCG set up alongside the tables for firefighters, police officers, etc.
Also, FWIW, I joined the USAF when I was 17 and I had to get parental permission.
Posts: 918 | From: Southern CA | Registered: Jan 2004
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Also, FWIW, I joined the USAF when I was 17 and I had to get parental permission.
Why did you join at 17? I guess I don't understand why there is any need to commit to something at 17, when you need to get an adult's permission to do it, that you can just as easily do on your own at 18. Is there any benefit to joining at 17?
-------------------- If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, it's just possible you haven't grasped the situation. - Jean Kerr Posts: 18428 | From: Ontario, Canada | Registered: Nov 2001
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quote:Originally posted by Christie: Thinking about the army as a career is something I have no problem with
What I got from your posts is that you don't believe minors should be asked to think about the armed forces as a career, though. You suggested that military recruiters should not be allowed to talk to minors about a career in the military. I've said nothing about my opinions on minors actually joining.
quote:I agree with others though that to compare joining the Armed Forces with deciding you might like to go to law school is not even in the same ballpark
Except that's not at all what I was comparing. My specific objections are to the idea that recruiters shouldn't even talk to high school students.
Deciding one wants to be a soldier and having to either wait until he or she is of legal or age or having to discuss it and gain the consent of his or her parents - with full knowledge of the legal commitment - is really about the same thing as "I want to go to law school" and taking the same steps to prepare.
-------------------- "You're the opposite of troll. It's a compliment!" Posts: 12086 | From: Alberta | Registered: Feb 2000
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quote:Originally posted by Christie: Why did you join at 17? I guess I don't understand why there is any need to commit to something at 17, when you need to get an adult's permission to do it, that you can just as easily do on your own at 18. Is there any benefit to joining at 17?
For some people, freedom. My dad joined at 16 because that was his ticket out of poverty and abuse. His only regret is that he let my mother bully him into switching from career military to reservist.
For others, the benefit is simply getting started on what they know they want to do. Had I been able to join (health problems prevented me), it would have been because I was 17 when I graduated and there was no sense in waiting around unemployed for 6 months to my 18th birthday to get started on my intended career path. I knew as well at 17 as I did at 18 what I wanted. Actually, I knew at 15.
-------------------- "You're the opposite of troll. It's a compliment!" Posts: 12086 | From: Alberta | Registered: Feb 2000
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Hey, it was 4:30 in the morning! (that's my excuse)![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
