Pretty Punks Hate Vday
The Red and the Green Stamps
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Scary Doctor Facts This is really something to think about: A. The number of physicians in the US is 700,000 B. Accidental deaths caused by physicians per year is 120,000 C. Accidental deaths per physician is 0.171 (US Dept of Health & Human Services). Then think about this: A. The number of gun owners in the US is 80,000,000. B. The number of accidental gun deaths per year (all age groups) is 1,500. C. The number of accidental deaths per gun owner is .0000188. Statistically, doctors are approximately 9,000 times more dangerous than gun owners. FACT: NOT EVERYONE HAS A GUN, BUT ALMOST EVERYONE HAS AT LEAST ONE DOCTOR. Please alert your friends to this alarming threat. We must ban doctors before this gets out of hand. As a public health measure I have withheld the statistics on lawyers for fear that the shock could cause people to seek medical attention.
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So how many non-accidental death with guns as compaired to doctors? And how many doctors have been used in the commision of a crime?
Posts: 547 | From: Toronto | Registered: Nov 2002
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quote:Originally posted by DerekT: And how many doctors have been used in the commision of a crime?
Ask Rush.
-------------------- "When a stupid man is doing something he is ashamed of, he always declares that it is his duty."--George Bernard Shaw Posts: 19266 | From: Nashville, TN | Registered: Jun 2002
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No, only if you are both patient AND target
-------------------- Opinions aren't excuses to remain ignorant about subjects, nor are they excuses to never examine one's beliefs & prejudices...
Babies are like tattoos. You see other peoples' & they're cool, but yours is never as good & you can't get rid of it. Posts: 5622 | From: Jax, Florida | Registered: Nov 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Elbe, feelin' the love: And yet, I trust my doctor more than a gun when I'm sick.
Agreed, however when I'm being attacked and have to defend myself I trust my gun more than my doctor for that. He is rather elderly and I don't think quite as effective.
-------------------- I'm a sheepdog. I live to protect the flock and confront the wolf. -- On Sheep, Wolves and Sheepdogs by LTC. Dave Grossman, USA (Ret) Posts: 675 | From: Arizona | Registered: Jun 2003
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quote:Originally posted by DerekT: So how many non-accidental death with guns as compaired to doctors?
Some thousand vs. Several tens of thousands, if you count foeti, considerably less if you don't.
Not counting doctors who use guns to kill people.
It's a spurious comparison, really.
OTOH, Q: What do you call a med student who gets a 60% on his final exams?
A: Doctor.
The medical profession really needs better quality control. It'd keep the malpractice suits (and thusly the cost of healthcare) down.
-------------------- "Liberalism is a philosophy of consolation for western civilization as it commits suicide." - Jerry Pournelle Posts: 14567 | From: Pennsylvania | Registered: Jan 2002
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Rhiandmoi
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV
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What is foeti?
-------------------- I think that hyperbole is the single greatest factor contributing to the decline of society. - My friend Pat.
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I think that the actual number of people getting "attacked" has been confabulated.
Either that, or I, and everybody I know are just the luckiest people on earth.
-------------------- "When a stupid man is doing something he is ashamed of, he always declares that it is his duty."--George Bernard Shaw Posts: 19266 | From: Nashville, TN | Registered: Jun 2002
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Chiajedi hates valentine's day.
The Red and the Green Stamps
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quote:Originally posted by rhiandmoi sitting in the tree: What is foeti?
Plural of fetus. Or foetus if you don't type in American.
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mizake the mizan
The Red and the Green Stamps
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is it pick on doctors day?
quote:"Why Lawyers are Better than Doctors"
Lawyers provide an optional service. If you wish to obtain legal assitance, you hire a lawyer. However, you are also free to research the law and defend yourself if you so choose.
Dcotors have formed a cartel to make their service mandatory. You must see a doctor to obtain a perscription. You are not allowed to do your own research and choose your own treatment.
quote:Originally posted by Angl Hearts and Minds Rdr: I think that the actual number of people getting "attacked" has been confabulated.
Either that, or I, and everybody I know are just the luckiest people on earth.
I am happy for you, and wish you and everybody you know your continued luck. I wish people did't get attacked but unfortunately it does happen.
-------------------- I'm a sheepdog. I live to protect the flock and confront the wolf. -- On Sheep, Wolves and Sheepdogs by LTC. Dave Grossman, USA (Ret) Posts: 675 | From: Arizona | Registered: Jun 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Troodon: Something to note: by law, doctors must be licensed, but they have not been outlawed and confiscated yet.
Yes, but their arn't organizations with the opinion that by their very design, doctors are extremely dangerous and about to kill a lot of innocent people. Their arn't organizations that are actively attempting to pass legislation to outlaw certain types of doctors because even though they are still just doctors nobody really needs these particular kind. I don't recall doctors being constitutionaly protected.
-------------------- I'm a sheepdog. I live to protect the flock and confront the wolf. -- On Sheep, Wolves and Sheepdogs by LTC. Dave Grossman, USA (Ret) Posts: 675 | From: Arizona | Registered: Jun 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Dark Blue: [QUOTE] Their arn't organizations that are actively attempting to pass legislation to outlaw certain types of doctors because even though they are still just doctors nobody really needs these particular kind.
Tell that to your local chiropracter, homeopath, or naturopath.
-------------------- "The bicycle is the most civilized conveyance known to man. Other forms of transport grow daily more nightmarish. Only the bicycle remains pure in heart."--Iris Murdoch Posts: 3307 | From: Charleston, WV | Registered: Oct 2002
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quote:Originally posted by mizake the mizan: is it pick on doctors day?
quote:"Why Lawyers are Better than Doctors"
Lawyers provide an optional service. If you wish to obtain legal assitance, you hire a lawyer. However, you are also free to research the law and defend yourself if you so choose.
Dcotors have formed a cartel to make their service mandatory. You must see a doctor to obtain a perscription. You are not allowed to do your own research and choose your own treatment.
Actually, it's perfectly legal for you to perform surgery on yourself. However, like defending yourself in a felony trial, it's a really bad idea.
Silas
-------------------- When on music's mighty pinion, souls of men to heaven rise, Then both vanish earth's dominion, man is native to the skies. Posts: 16801 | From: San Diego, CA | Registered: Sep 2000
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Blue Jam
The Red and the Green Stamps
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As that old saying goes: "A man who performs open-heart surgery on himself has a fool for a patient." Or something like that.
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Blue Jam
The Red and the Green Stamps
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Specious argument - it's the non-accidental gun deaths that are the big problem. Number of deliberate doctor deaths is quite small.
* The accidental doctor deaths happen while the doctor is trying to save your life, * The accidental gun deaths are when someone hasn't locked their gun up properly or cleans it without checking it ain't loaded.
Hardly a comparison.
How's about
* how many lives doctors save vs how many guns save. * UK deaths from guns vs US deaths from guns.
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Bulldon
The Red and the Green Stamps
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quote:Originally posted by Blue Jam: The accidental gun deaths are when someone hasn't locked their gun up properly or cleans it without checking it ain't loaded.
ive never understood how you can clean a gun while its loaded, it just doesnt work that way. i always though that that excuse was given buy people that were being stupid.
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quote:Originally posted by Angl Hearts and Minds Rdr: I think that the actual number of people getting "attacked" has been confabulated.
Either that, or I, and everybody I know are just the luckiest people on earth.
I am happy for you, and wish you and everybody you know your continued luck. I wish people did't get attacked but unfortunately it does happen.
I'm not saying that people don't get attacked. I am saying that I don't think that guns save quite the number of people from attacks as some would have us believe.
-------------------- "When a stupid man is doing something he is ashamed of, he always declares that it is his duty."--George Bernard Shaw Posts: 19266 | From: Nashville, TN | Registered: Jun 2002
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quote:Originally posted by Blue Jam: How's about [...]* UK deaths from guns vs US deaths from guns.
Not a truly valid comparison. A better one would be of every country over a series of years. That would prevent someone from manipulating the data by purposefully comparing a country with a low crime rate for a given year with a country with a high crime rate. You'd also need to separate deaths from legal guns from deaths from illegal guns (and probably also have to separate law enforcement usage out).
It's about the same as comparing a year where the UK suffered heavily from terrorist attacks to a year the US was free of terrorist attacks and concluding that the monarchy, tea, or something else uniquely UK leads to terrorism.
-------------------- All posts foretold by Nostradamus.
Turing test failures: 6 Posts: 5481 | From: Decatur, GA | Registered: Nov 2002
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Jason, I was explaining specfically about the numbers of attacked people being saved because they were packing heat. The DoJ Uniform Crime Report doesn't require LEOs to record that data, so I have a hard time believing the numbers given by the NRA.
IOW, their anecdotes are no more valid than mine.
-------------------- "When a stupid man is doing something he is ashamed of, he always declares that it is his duty."--George Bernard Shaw Posts: 19266 | From: Nashville, TN | Registered: Jun 2002
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quote:Originally posted by Troodon: Another shocking fact: the medical treatment approximately half of Americans recieve is below the national average.
I have to admit to being outraged by this. It's time we did something to make all health care above the national average.
-------------------- "Nothing is so firmly believed as what we least know." ~ Michel Eyquem de Montaigne Posts: 1382 | From: Toronto, Ontario | Registered: Aug 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Dark Blue: [QUOTE] Their arn't organizations that are actively attempting to pass legislation to outlaw certain types of doctors because even though they are still just doctors nobody really needs these particular kind.
Tell that to your local chiropracter, homeopath, or naturopath.
Well, as soon as someone manages to convince me that a homeopath/naturopath/the kind of chiropractor who gives the rest a bad name by claiming that prodding your spine will cure all known diseases is a doctor in any sense other than that they call themselves one, we'll take that up.
I could go out tomorrow and start telling people that if I whack them in the face with a newspaper it will cure all their ills, and there will be people who will believe it, but that won't make me a doctor, or my treatment proper medical practice.
Posts: 3700 | From: New York | Registered: Aug 2000
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quote:Originally posted by Cynestria: [...] I could go out tomorrow and start telling people that if I whack them in the face with a newspaper it will cure all their ills, and there will be people who will believe it, but that won't make me a doctor, or my treatment proper medical practice.
My doctor used to hit me in the face with a newspaper all the time. That's the main reason I stopped going to a vet.
-------------------- "Nothing is so firmly believed as what we least know." ~ Michel Eyquem de Montaigne Posts: 1382 | From: Toronto, Ontario | Registered: Aug 2003
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I would rather be treated by a vet than by a doctor, I think they generally know more about what they are doing. Havn't actually put it to the test though. Still go see my doctor on a regular basis.
Angl hearts- I would like to refer you to the Armed Citizen section of the NRA's publications. Rather than simply relay stories sent to them by memebers, it seems that they are exerpts from newspapers which should be varifiable one way or the other.
-------------------- I'm a sheepdog. I live to protect the flock and confront the wolf. -- On Sheep, Wolves and Sheepdogs by LTC. Dave Grossman, USA (Ret) Posts: 675 | From: Arizona | Registered: Jun 2003
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Newspaper reports are still anecdotal evidence.
-------------------- "When a stupid man is doing something he is ashamed of, he always declares that it is his duty."--George Bernard Shaw Posts: 19266 | From: Nashville, TN | Registered: Jun 2002
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quote:Originally posted by Angl Hearts and Minds Rdr: Newspaper reports are still anecdotal evidence.
Yes but should still be varifiable if the incident actually happened or not.
Are not newspapr articles one of the first steps we take here to determine if something is true or not? I'm certainly not suggesting we stop there by any means, but it is a jumping off point.
-------------------- I'm a sheepdog. I live to protect the flock and confront the wolf. -- On Sheep, Wolves and Sheepdogs by LTC. Dave Grossman, USA (Ret) Posts: 675 | From: Arizona | Registered: Jun 2003
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spam me, slam me
The Red and the Green Stamps
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If I break my leg, find a funny looking infection on my skin, or notice that I suddenly grew a third testacle overnight, I'll take my chances with the doctor. If I don't like what they say, I'll go to the gun for a second opinion.
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