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Author Topic: Global Warming Study - the Sun Is Hot
abbubmah
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


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A physics student notices something about temperature data collection.

quote:
So why is it that in most recent times, we are heating up during the heat of the day and not at other times? Admittedly it is only a small sample size of 5 years, but it might well be worth some debate.
His premise is that the "global warming" data is taken from Min/Max data, rather than data points at different times of the day. From the limited data available, it seems that temperatures are only higher during the day, and that the mean average nighttime temperature has not changed significantly; which it would if there were an increase in the global average temperature.

Interesting.

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Fundamentally Unfundie since 1975

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snapdragonfly
Happy Xmas (Warranty Is Over)


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I have a question - there are all these charts and graphs, some proving the earth isn't warming, some proving it is, and so forth.

But it's an irrefutable fact that the glaciers are melting. They are receding and just going away. The Permafrost is melting.

How could this be happening if something weren't changing?

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"Wolves, dragons and vampires, man. Draw the nut-bars like big ol' nut-bar magnets." ~evilrabbit

(snurched because one of my nutbar family members is all about wolves and another one is all about dragons...)(with apologies to surfcitydogdad)

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Pseudo_Croat
Angels Wii Have Heard on High


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quote:
Originally posted by redsnapperdragonfly:
But it's an irrefutable fact that the glaciers are melting. They are receding and just going away. The Permafrost is melting.

How could this be happening if something weren't changing?

Well, we are coming out of an ice age....

- Pseudo_Croat

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"At all events, people who deny the influence of smaller nations should remember that the Croats have the rest of us by the throats." - Norman Davies, Europe: A History

God wants spiritual fruits, not religious nuts.

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snapdragonfly
Happy Xmas (Warranty Is Over)


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But the sudden, dramatic and shocking acceleration of these changes is disturbing. If geologic changes should occur in "geologic" time, then someone taking an Alaskan cruise in the early 80's shouldn't be seeing the same glaciers receding thousands and thousands of feet when they take the same cruise just a decade and a half later. This is more change in just a few years than we've seen ever since we've been able to pay attention to this stuff in recent history - shrugging it off as "we are coming out of an ice age" doesn't address these disturbing issues and leaves me utterly unconvinced. Yes, obviously things have melted before, but it's the rate at which it is happening now, that is so scarey, and that remains unexplained (as far as I can tell) by all the charts, smoke and mirrors crowd.

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"Wolves, dragons and vampires, man. Draw the nut-bars like big ol' nut-bar magnets." ~evilrabbit

(snurched because one of my nutbar family members is all about wolves and another one is all about dragons...)(with apologies to surfcitydogdad)

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BeachLife
The Bills of St. Mary's


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quote:
Originally posted by redsnapperdragonfly:
...If geologic changes should occur in "geologic" time, then someone taking an Alaskan cruise in the early 80's shouldn't be seeing the same glaciers receding thousands and thousands of feet when they take the same cruise just a decade and a half later...

And then they see the Hubbard glacier which is advancing...

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Wisdom comes with age, but sometimes age comes alone.
Jack Dragon, On Being a Dragon
Confessions of a Dragon's scribe
Diary of my Heart Surgery

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eif
Jingle Bell Hock


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He is looking at one tree, and thinks he can describe the forest.

A recent Nova program brought to light (to the masses) how particle polution may be cooling the earth. The end result is that global warming is less than it could be, but if we clean up the particle polution to get cleaner air, we could double or triple the effect of green house gases that we release.

The Nova program site is here

This may have been mentioned on this site recently.

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Where I come from we believe all sorts of things that aren't true. We call it History.

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Ganzfeld
Let There Be PCs on Earth


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quote:
Originally posted by Pseudo_Croat:
Well, we are coming out of an ice age....

Oh, boy. Here we go again with the "coming out of" or "going into" an ice age thing. Ice age cycles are not regular events like day and night. The atmosphere is as warm now as it ever has been at any other recent interglacial period. Nobody knows how long this interglacial will be, when it will peak, or when the cycle will trend down again.
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abbubmah
Ding Dong! Merrily on High Definition TV


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It is obvious that there is change. Whether it is atypical or not is the question. Simply that "things aren't like they used to be" doesn't mean it isn't part of some normal cycle. I don't doubt that humans are able to make some impact on the climate, but I believe the evidence is still out on how much we ARE affecting it, due to our relatively short-termed study of the climate.

I was explaining to my kids, while discussing the tsunami, that we learned in elementary school in the '60s, things about tsunamis, tidal waves, volcanoes, and the like. (middle of Iowa, I knew which way to run from a tidal wave, though.) This was in response to "we've never had anything like this happen before". My elementary school geology was full of presently-erupting volcanoes and amazing natural occurrences.

Now, either we don't have as many, or it isn't being taught, I don't know. However, in just a generation, the memory of those types of events is "way in the past", not as recently as the 1960's. I use this as an example of how some things don't persist in our memories. The earth is as the earth is - until we notice something changing. We might not notice all the little things that lead up to the change, but when it becomes obvious, it's a big deal.

Ice age or no, it's generally thought that our climate DOES go through cycles. What these are, exactly, and how long they take to occur, is unknown.

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Fundamentally Unfundie since 1975

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Troberg
Angels Wii Have Heard on High


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quote:
I was explaining to my kids, while discussing the tsunami, that we learned in elementary school in the '60s, things about tsunamis, tidal waves, volcanoes, and the like. (middle of Iowa, I knew which way to run from a tidal wave, though.) This was in response to "we've never had anything like this happen before". My elementary school geology was full of presently-erupting volcanoes and amazing natural occurrences.
I agree. Humanity has always been expecting the end ot the world and always forgets previous events.

We do not have enough data to say if these events are caused by man or not, but we know that the climate has undergone radical changes before, and that it has happened quite rapidly. What we also know is that, despite drastic changes, even to the point of making the entire earth a snowball or storms of vapourized rock enveloping the planet due to meteor strikes, life will survive. Perhaps not life as we know it, but it will survuive.

As for tsunamis, earthquakes, hurricanes, volcanoes, tornadoes, floods and so on, let's just be rational and blame it all on al Qaida.

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/Troberg

Posts: 4360 | From: Borlänge, Sweden | Registered: Nov 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
   

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