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Author Topic: Exploding water pipes?
Nolly
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Looks as if it may be an unaltered photo. My question is, has anyone ever seen these photos before. Is the accompanying text accurate or did something else happen? [Confused]

Subject: READ FIRST THEN OPEN


House in the Canadian country .... $1 Million
Three luxury cars .... $150,000
Leaving town during a cold winter without turning off the water pipes in your garage
.... PRICELESS!


http://www.boomspeed.com/nolleez/garage.jpg

No "Glad I live in southern Ontario" ly
[Razz]

[ 10. October 2003, 10:24 AM: Message edited by: Jenn O'Lantern ]

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abbubmah
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There's greenery outside the windows.

Also, look at the "peeling ice" in the near foreground.

I have no idea what this is. A burst pipe would burst in one place, not across three cars. Evenly.

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BeachLife
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If that's picture and captain is true, there's something wrong with the house design or, more likely, the heat in the garage went out. Even then, I doubt the water would have gushed all over all three cars. More likely the pipes would have burst in a single spot.

My guess would be that a sprinkler system was activated or there was a fire which was put out with fire hoses, more likely the former.

*ETA, I just noticed the ceiling insulation. The garage wasn't heated and wouldn not have had water pipes in the ceiling. I'm guessing a garage fire.

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abbubmah
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quote:
Originally posted by BeachLife:
I'm guessing a garage fire.

Ah. I thought it might have come from above. That makes sense, a fire in the area immediately above the garage. There does seem to be more around the walls, where you would expect it to run through.

(edited: would a leaky pipe in an upstairs heated area cause this? I think it's possible, but that's a LOT of water.)

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pajordan
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A pipe on the upper floor burst and seeped through the floorboards. How do I know?
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the Virgin Marrya
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seep being teh operative word here.

No sudden inrush of water is going to freeze that way..more a steady drip over time + cold.

Am I right?

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BeachLife
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quote:
Originally posted by Shadow of a Bubba:
quote:
Originally posted by BeachLife:
I'm guessing a garage fire.

Ah. I thought it might have come from above. That makes sense, a fire in the area immediately above the garage. There does seem to be more around the walls, where you would expect it to run through.

(edited: would a leaky pipe in an upstairs heated area cause this? I think it's possible, but that's a LOT of water.)

That's working for me, especially since the water apparently rose to something like 8 inches deep. This makes a garage fire, doused through the garage door unlikely. Some of the insulation is falling down too which adds creadance to the idea that it came from above.

Also note that it isn't evenly distributed. The car on the far left has much less ice. There's a spot on the rear of the middle car where there was apparently a concentration of water. It also looks like water was definitely flowing down from above the left wall of the garage.

The ice is too rough for slow sleepage and there would definitely be icicles from above if this happened. I'm guessing a burst pipe above where water built up, with some trickles before something gave away gushing water down where it is concentrated. It than continued to poor down from above until the water problem was solved.

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abbubmah
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quote:
Originally posted by BeachLife:
The ice is too rough for slow sleepage and there would definitely be icicles from above if this happened.

Ah, but what if it were a hot water pipe? No icicles until further away from the burst!

Still, look out those back windows. Green. Pine trees?

(ETA: the garage door is up, and there's ice on that!)

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BeachLife
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If you look out the left window, there's a tree which appears to be bare. If it's far enough north or high enough up, most of the trees would be firs so that's not surprise.

After blowing the picture up, there is definitely icicles on the ceiling and the insulation is way torn up. Hot water is a distinct possibility as it would explain why the ice is so strange looking.

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Snafucated
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Well, the caption is pure fabrication:

1. A house in the Canadian country - unlikely, the sign on the wall would probably read CAA, rather than the American AAA.

2. Water pipes in the garage - nobody in a cold climate would have anything more than an outside tap on the wall with the house... heated garage or not.

The photo looks very real to me, though. I don't have a problem with greenery outside (conifers), and I'm not sure what Bubba means by peeling ice.

Perhaps the hot tub on the floor above leaked... poor rich folks!

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abbubmah
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quote:
Originally posted by Snafucated:
I'm not sure what Bubba means by peeling ice.

That white thing on the floor. The edges of teh ice around it look strange, but could just be perspective.

quote:

Perhaps the hot tub on the floor above leaked... poor rich folks!

You know... that's plausible. Fascinating theory!

ham "amazing what a bunch of skeptical eyes can see in a photo" bubba

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Yukikaza
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quote:
I'm not sure what Bubba means by peeling ice.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That white thing on the floor. The edges of teh ice around it look strange, but could just be perspective.

It looks a little odd to me, perspective or not; I can't even tell what it's supposed to be. any suggestions?

As for the rest of it...

The green tree in the right window looks like a fir. The tree in the right window is bare. That's the second thin I noticed. The AAA seems unlikely for Canada, but who knows? they might have lived in America for a while, and brought that with them...

You can see the icecicles with it enlarged, and the entire right hand wall looks like the water was running down it. Areas on the rest of the walls show water running down them as well. The insulation looks like it's gotten wet, as well.

Looking at it, I would have to say the "hot tub breaking" is actually quite plausible. I'm going to second that theory.

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Noemi
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Could the white thing in the forground be something like the paper off of drywall or the backing for insulation? Or could it be a cardboard box that fell apart and moved to that area by the water?

Noemi

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Nolly
Fin City


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quote:
Originally posted by Snafucated:
Well, the caption is pure fabrication:

1. A house in the Canadian country - unlikely, the sign on the wall would probably read CAA, rather than the American AAA.

Perhaps the hot tub on the floor above leaked... poor rich folks!

Some Canuck I am...I didn't even connect the "House in the Canadian country" and the AAA sign! DUH! [dunce]
The most logical sounds like the hot tub theory, although all other reasons are plausible as well.
Thanks everyone! [Smile]
No "Only wish I found this forum sooner" ly

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cstam1979
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It may look to be unaltered but you never know. In most cases garages are built to the side of the house but since only the garage is visible we don't know. However, if the person would have needed to drain the pipes it would be a vacation home. Why then are three cars in the garage. Everyone knows that if a car sits in the winter and you don't run it your battery will die. So if the hottub leaked it would have leaked for a long time. I don't think its real and by the way the ice on one of the cars looks like soap bubbles.
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Double Latte
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I have a question, just out of curiosity: Are these cars a complete loss? I admit I know nothing about cars, especially the effects of extreme cold and moisture on cars. But what I wonder is, other than the paint job (and what appears to be a soft top on the center car) is there necessarily extensive damage to the cars?

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BeachLife
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quote:
Originally posted by cstam1979:
...In most cases garages are built to the side of the house but since only the garage is visible we don't know...

Except that there is insulation in the ceiling which tells us that either the garage is heated and on one side of the hosue or part of the house is above the garage. The walls and garage door don't appear to be insulated which would indicate the latter.

quote:
Originally posted by Double Treats:
I have a question, just out of curiosity: Are these cars a complete loss? I admit I know nothing about cars, especially the effects of extreme cold and moisture on cars. But what I wonder is, other than the paint job (and what appears to be a soft top on the center car) is there necessarily extensive damage to the cars?

My best guess is those cars are far from a total loss. I don't know that there's any claim what so ever unless the ice was heavy enough to cause a roof colapse. If ice were cause for damage to your car and an insurance claim, I'd be claiming on my insurance several times a year.

Beach...though it's rarely quite that bad...Life!

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Goes-hmmm
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My guess, judging from the icicles hanging from the open garage door:
Teenage son "borrowed" Dad's Porsche, leaving the garage door open so he could coast down the street into the garage undetected and either forgot to close the garage door or again, didn't want to alert Dad to his misdeed. This resulted in the garage door being left open all night in subzero temperatures, which froze the water pipes between the ceiling of the garage and upstairs rooms. The pipe split lengthwise allowing water to spread pretty evenly over the drywall sheetrock in the garage ceiling, dripping down between the seams forming icicles. The drywall (the white stuff in the photo) and insulation (the red stuff hanging down) became saturated and caved in with the weight of the icicles assisting. This allowed the split pipe to flow more freely over the cars in the subzero garage.

The damages to the cars should be minimal except where icicles and drywall material fell on them from the ceiling. I've had nearly that much ice on my cars before just from an Oklahoma ice storm, which brings me to the next point, this doesn't necessarily have to be "up north" because here in Oklahoma we usually have at least a few days below zero (Fahrenheit) every winter and that's pretty far south.

I've seen almost exactly this sort of thing when I lived in Wyoming, garage door (garage in basement) left open, water pipes burst, flooding garage, leaving a foot of ice on everything below. What a mess!

[Edited to add: In a 20 foot by 30 foot garage, 4 inches deep ice figures up to be bit over 1300 gallons of water, not all that much from a leak from a split pipe, less than $2 worth of water in my area.]


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Dr. Van Thorp
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I think it's funny that when someone posts a photo like this, someone always immediately tries to find something to prove it's a fake. This is not a jackalope photo.
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LizzyJingleBells
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quote:
Originally posted by Dr. Van Thorp:
I saw a similar jet photo in Sky and Telescope many years ago, but in the old photo, the moon was full and the jet was a silouhette.

Possibly because in this forum
quote:
This is the forum for posting "Is this picture real . . .?" queries. This forum is only for pictures of questionable authenticity
I have another theory...vandals. Some neighboor hood kids grabbed the hose and got into the garage on a very cold night. Just a thought.

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Chimera
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quote:
Originally posted by Dr. Van Thorp:
I think it's funny that when someone posts a photo like this, someone always immediately tries to find something to prove it's a fake. This is not a jackalope photo.

Nope, not a jackalope.

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Yukikaza
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I suggested this one to Mythbusters...

If it gets enough views to become a "hot topic", they might do it... it'll be very interesting to see if they can figure out what would have had to have happened.

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The Eyeball Kid
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My mother has a CAA sign, and she lives in South Carolina. I don't think the sign holds much plausibiliy when it comes to location of incident. Also, to the right, is what appears to be either an old Coca-Cola sign or a similar advertising tin. Possibly a sign/antique collector in this house.

As far as the water having a "soapy" look - I'm gonna make another vote for hot-tub burst here. The reason being: when warm/hot water freezes quickly, it usually has bubbles in the frozen form, giving the soapy illusion.

EK

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Priss Asagiri
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I've sorta rethought the idea of Fire Sprinklers that might've caused this, and I offer this explanation:

Perhaps the home has an old Fire Sprinkler System. Instead of some control or computer that only sprays water to certain sections of the house, water gushes out regardless.

A fire occured elsewhere in the home, which tripped off the sprinklers. Sprinklers begin to gush, and soon, the home is doused in water.

Sprinklers in the garage gush water, producing the effect shown. Also note that on the Porsche, you see a "column" of water. Perhaps done by the sprinklers still dripping water after their turned off.

Let me put this theory in more related terms: When you dip a taper wick into molten wax, some of the wax "adheare" to the wick, and as you pull it out, it dries. Dip again, some of the wax melts, while more get's desposited and soon, the wax builds onto the wick until you have a candle.

Same idea here. As the sprinklers spray water, it slowly builds up a sheet of Ice. The cars might act like huge metal ice cubes to "freeze" the water.

The theory of a Tub of Water "imploding" seems to be ridiculous. If the tub somehow collapsed, it would dump a huge ammount of water and most, if not all the water would be mostly on the ground, not on the cars before it froze. There would be maybe be a more thicker ammount of ice on the ground than on the cars.

But I do offer this alternate theory: Tub implodes, dumps water onto cars, water freezes on contact, and a burst pipe or three (Perhaps fed by the Water Heater and the Water Main) shoot water, and it begins the layers of ice on the cars.

As for the destroyed foam? Water seeps into foam, freezes and expands, and viola...ruined insulation.

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Snafucated
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Plausibility... note the use of words such as unlikely, common, and rare rather than impossible.

Pipe burst theory: It is unlikely that there would be water pipes in the ceiling of a garage. Most people are not that stupid.

Sprinklers theory: It is extremely rare for a private home to have a water sprinkler system.

Probable location: It is more likely to see a CAA sign in Canada than an AAA sign, although I have seen them.

Hot tub theory: It is unlikely that one would completely give out. It is, however, common that the internal pipes/pump freeze and crack causing a leak when the power dies in a cold environment.


So here is another theory. Fire trucks blasted the area above with water to extinguish a fire.

It is unknown whether there is even a room above the garage. There could simply a roof, a heated room, or an open outside deck. However, there is a beam running along the width of the celing, which would indicate an upper level.

The fire truck scenario would account for the water source in the case where there is only a roof above the garage.

Many hot tubs, especially those outside, are filled by garden hose rather than a connection to the water supply. This does not preclude some moron running pipes through the garge ceiling, but I think that is just not the cause here.

I'm convinced that the water (whatever the source) was spread out over the entire area above the garage and leaked down from there (more in some areas than others). I highly doubt that a single-point leak within the ceiling would spread out so much since the joysts would prevent it... seepage along the entire ceiling could occur, but not significant water flow. Yes, there was a drywall ceiling. You can see remnants of it hanging down above the SUV, still attached above the Porche, and on the floor here and there (most noticeably to the right or the Porche, between the SUV and VW, and in the foreground near that white poly or whatever.

All theories aside, this photo is not doctored. To me, all the elements in the image are perfect.

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Atlanta Jake
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I'm sorry, but I have certainly seen houses with plumbing in the ceilings and walls of garages. If you look to the right of the Porsche, you will see ice that looks like a stalagmite. This would appear to be the place where the water was coming from. if you have ever seen a burst pipe, you have probably seen that they often split longitudenally, (oooo! big word! [Big Grin] ) and spray in a fine spray. I believe that is what happened. It looks to me like there is an outside spigot in the right hand wall, and that the garage was left open, causing the pipe to burst and coating the cars from right to left.

As far as wether or not people put plumbing in garages, this could be in a place that does not get weather that cold very often. My garage in Atlanta has lots of plumbing in it as my water heater and laundry room are in a room just off of the garage.

Atlanta "Hitler on ice" Jake

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BlackForge
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I will guess a more common thing that might have happen. The hot water tank rusted thru up stairs while the people were on vacation (probably some were a lot warmer).
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Jason Threadslayer
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Hunting for better images...

It seems that it didn't happen in Canada...
Minnesota?
Michigan?
Wisconson?

Or maybe it was Canada... Alberta?

Apparently, it happened to someone else, too. Too bad the picture ain't there.

Quest for better image, failed.

Could the MD sticker mean Maryland?

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Snafucated
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Well Jake, looks like you know a thing or two about this stuff, but I'll argue you just the same.

Again it comes down to likelyhood. I think its a good bet that the location is somewhere that gets some regular sustained cold weather... those are some large ice formations. In this case, it would be rare (and a huge mistake) to run water lines. I would not be surprised if many regions have building codes that prohibit it.

I have seen burst pipes (copper), and the ones I've seen gave out at the joints. But I'll take your word on that one.

I am pretty familiar with ice, though, and horizontal spray doesn't jibe with me. A fine spray of water would give a much more even coverage. The ice formations indicate several vertical leaks. As you pointed out, there are stalagmite formations... but there are several. I see the one you were referring to, but I don't see a spigot. The drip lines along the back wall also suggest leakage from above.

For your theory to work, (and I agree that it is possible), I would think that the spray would have to be able to soak the drywall celing enough to saturate it, maybe build up some ice weight, enough to bring it down. Then you could get the vertical dripping from from the joysts and insulation. I just think that a flood from above is much more plausible. Notice the stalagmite at the top center of Porche's rear window. Looks like a perfect example of water falling straight down and flowing out in all directions.

But you deal with water all the time... so if I send a spray along a ceiling from end to end, would the water spread out to all corners of the room and drip down consistently in several different locations?

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Priss Asagiri
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quote:
Originally posted by Snafucated:
Sprinklers theory: It is extremely rare for a private home to have a water sprinkler system.

Then prove to me that this house doesn't have a sprinkler system.
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Snafucated
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BlackForge, a water tank would be a possible source for water from above. But aren't they normally located on the lowest level of a dwelling?
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BoKu
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Sort of off-topic, but it does demonstrate the possible validity of the OP photos:

A few years ago I was working in my FIL's machine shop, located in his 2-car garage. It was December or January, and ambient temperatures were about 25 degrees F. I had a propane radiant heater on while working at the lathe.

Anyhow, I hear a funny noise behind me, and I turn around. Water was pouring out of an electrical outlet in the ceiling, one where there's usually a fluorescent light plugged in.

So help me, the first thought through my head was "My god - the electricity has liquified. Now that's cold!"

When we got it sorted out, we figured out that the pipes for the sprinklers built into the roof had frozen over and cracked the copper tubing. As long as the pipes stayed frozen, they didn't drip any. But as the radiant heater raised the garage temperature, it unfroze the pipes and water flowed through the cracks. The water puddled up on the upper surface of the drywall until it found an outlet to the space below.

Oh - the sprinklers. The were built into the roof for protection from brushfires. This is in California's Sierra foothills, and the intent is to wet the roof down to make it less likely that the house will catch fire. They usually turned off the sprinklers and drained the system for the winter time, but that year they'd forgotten.

Bob "" K.

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Fowlplay
The First USA Noel


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I don't think any of us can say 'yes' or 'no' as to whether this is real without some other background or reference. In my personal experience, I've seen a lot of water damaged homes from differenct sources (fires, burst pipes, flooding, etc.) and I can say that it is truly amazing the amount of damage even a small leak can cause. I recently went into a house where the ice-maker hose had come of the back of the refrigerator and within a few hours (overnight) had filled the entire 2000 square foot house with roughly 3 inches of water. And I also have seen a lot of houses that run plumbing through ceilings in places where you wouldn't normally expect it. Long story short: it doesn't take a long time for a small amount of water to cause a huge amount of damage. I can definatley see this happening as the result of a busted pipe or (if the house is a split-level with living area above the garage) a back-ed up toilet, tub, etc.

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"Sometimes it will be fluffy bunnies and cotton candy. Sometimes it will be napalm and defoliants. Sometimes it is roasted bunnies." -Rhiandmoi

Posts: 627 | From: San Antonio, TX | Registered: Oct 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Atlanta Jake
Xboxing Day


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quote:
Originally posted by Snafucated:
For your theory to work, (and I agree that it is possible), I would think that the spray would have to be able to soak the drywall celing enough to saturate it, maybe build up some ice weight, enough to bring it down.

I can tell you from experience that it doesn't take much water to make most of a ceiling or wall come down.

quote:
Then you could get the vertical dripping from from the joysts and insulation. I just think that a flood from above is much more plausible.
Yeah, on second thought, I guess water from above is more likely... but certainly your not suggesting that the water fell all at once? It would take a flow of water to build up these stalagmites... they would have to freeze in layers.

quote:
Notice the stalagmite at the top center of Porche's rear window. Looks like a perfect example of water falling straight down and flowing out in all directions.
Well, I can certainly see that possibility... the one on the Porsche does look like that!

quote:
But you deal with water all the time... so if I send a spray along a ceiling from end to end, would the water spread out to all corners of the room and drip down consistently in several different locations?
But that's part of my point. It's not even. It is thicker on the Porsche's side, and much thinner on the SUV's side.

Atlanta "I'll see if I can find a photo to illustrate what I maen" Jake

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Remember Kids, Don't try this at home!

Posts: 1366 | From: Atlanta, Georgia | Registered: Sep 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
Dr. Van Thorp
Deck the Malls


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quote:
Originally posted by LizzyBones:
Possibly because in this forum
quote:
This is the forum for posting "Is this picture real . . .?" queries. This forum is only for pictures of questionable authenticity

What I meant was that I think that its funny that someone tried to claim it was fake because there was a glint of green in the garage window. This photo does not look like a photomanipulation, and I can't imagine someone going to the expense of staging this scene in the middle of the summer just so that they can take a photo and fool some people on the internet.

Similarly, a couple of weeks ago, someone posted a link to a professional dog breeders page that cataloged types of markings on dogs that would make them unsuitable as show dogs. Someone tried to claim that one of the photos was a photomanipulation. Does a professional dog breeder want our attention so desperately that he needs to make fake photos of a puppy with a band of brown around his middle?

Yes, some photos are real.

Posts: 374 | From: Brighton, Michigan | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a moderator
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