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Animal or god?
The Red and the Green Stamps


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Map of the Creator

Scientists at Bashkir State University claim to have discovered
indisputable proof of an ancient highly developed civilization.
Stone slabs dated at 120 million years depict a relief map of the
Ural Region, including inscriptions of unknown origin.

CAUTION.This story comes from Pravda (the Russian word for 'of dubious
veracity'). Not like the good old Soviet days, when tractor production was
front page news.....

13:15 2002-05-30

3-D MAP OF THE EARTH CREATED 120 MILLIONS OF YEARS AGO. ON-LINE PRESS
CONFERENCE WITH ALEXANDR CHUVYROV
http://english.pravda.ru/main/2002/05/30/29507.html

June 6, at 4:00 p.m (Moscow Time) PRAVDA.Ru will hold an on-line press
conference with Doctor of Physical and Mathematical Science Alexandr
CHUVYROV. The professor of Bashkir State University found indisputable
evidence of the existence of an ancient, highly developed civilization in
the Urals. His find is a huge slab, whose age is supposed to be about 120
million years.

"Our research topic is about the possible migration of ancient Chinese to
the territory of modern Russia: Siberia and Urals. We have discovered
letters on the rocks made in ancient Chinese about 3000 years ago. During
our research in the Ufa archives, we discovered notes from the end of 18th
century about 200 unusual ancient stone plates. Our idea was that these
plates are somehow connected to Chinese migrants.

Thus we were looking for an ancient civilization, but much closer to
ourselves. We were expecting to see nothing more than hieroglyphs or
pictures with a running mammoth and deer typical for that period. There were
six expeditions organized, and in 28 July 1999, at 1.06 meters underground,
we found the plate now called "Dashkin kamen" ("kamen" is stone in Russian).
It has a significant size: about 1.5 meters in height, more than 1 meter
wide, and 16 cm thick. It weights more than 1 ton. In the scientists'
opinion, it is a relief, a 3-D map.

We were absolutely happy; we thought we found a product made more 2000 years
ago. The plate itself is artificial. It was produced from a special cement
of three layers, and the third layer is a white-colored porcelain. It should
be noticed that the relief on this plate was not cut manually with some
ancient stonecutter. It is evident that some mechanical work was done.

There is a region from Ufa up to the town of Salavat represented on the
plate. Ufa's hills are very familiar from one side. From the other side
there are some changes. Firstly, we were surprised by the Ufa canyon: the
break in the earth's crust from the present Ufa to the present Sterlitomak
city. There was a river in it 2-3 kilometers deep and 3-4 kilometers wide.
Nevertheless, this break is one of the principal points of our theory. We
conducted geological research and found it's track in the place where it
should be theoretically. Tectonic plates from the East crushed it for about
10-15 kilometers to the West. We assume that, now, the Urshak River is in
the place of this former canyon.

There are not only rivers, but two systems of channels up to 500 meters wide
and a total length of 12,000 kilometers. The whole hydro system includes 12
dams 300-500 meters wide, 10 kilometers long, and 2-3 kilometers deep. They
made it possible to turn water from any side into any channel. About 1000
trillion cubic meters of soil were moved to create this."

A.N.Chuvyrov
Specially for PRAVDA.Ru
Huang Hong

Copyright ©1999 by "Pravda.RU". When reproducing our materials in whole or
in part, reference to Pravda.RU should be made. The opinions and views of
the authors do not always coinside with the point of view of PRAVDA.Ru's
editors.

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The Dread Pirate Unwin
The Red and the Green Stamps


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Ancient but advanced civilizations, eh? Mysterious, cracked slabs of rock, eh? Methinks these scientists should leave well enough- Ia! Ia! Cthulhu fhtagn! Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah-nagl fhtaga -

Ahem. Sorry.

Paul "the Whalephant was as close to a Cthulhu smiley as I could get" Unwin

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phobia
The Red and the Green Stamps


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I really wish Carl Sagan was still alive. I'd be interested to know what he had to say on this. The oldest human skull has been found to be only 7 million years old by researchers working in Chad, with findings published in the peer reviewed journal Nature. Somehow that seems a little tiny bit more significant than an announcement in Pravda. Just for the record, in this month's Skeptical Inquirer there's a whole big long article on myth, magic and pseudoscience in Russia, which should shed some bright, glaring light onto this whole issue.

Bolshephobia

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bufungla
Let There Be PCs on Earth


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bookachow

buf 'Urally similar' ungla

--------------------
"Pardon him. Theodotus: he is a barbarian, and thinks that the customs of his tribe and island are the laws of nature."

George Bernard Shaw, Caesar and Cleopatra

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Animal or god?
The Red and the Green Stamps


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"Just for the record, in this month's Skeptical Inquirer there's a whole big long article on myth, magic and pseudoscience in Russia, which should shed some bright, glaring light onto this whole issue."

Many American scientists have always had a bit of a bee in their bonnet about their Russian colleagues. In part a Cold War hangover. This has meant at times they have doubled up on Russian research, especially in the area of space science.

I don't see how one article about bunkum in Russia is necessarily going to through light on this issue. Russia is a huge place with probably the most amazing scientific community there is (it survives despite everything including the "flea market" economy)... If the Russian equivalent of Sceptical Enquirer comes out I doubt it's going to cover every American scandal.

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phobia
The Red and the Green Stamps


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quote:
Originally posted by Animal or god?:
"Just for the record, in this month's Skeptical Inquirer there's a whole big long article on myth, magic and pseudoscience in Russia, which should shed some bright, glaring light onto this whole issue."

Many American scientists have always had a bit of a bee in their bonnet about their Russian colleagues. In part a Cold War hangover. This has meant at times they have doubled up on Russian research, especially in the area of space science.

I don't see how one article about bunkum in Russia is necessarily going to through light on this issue. Russia is a huge place with probably the most amazing scientific community there is (it survives despite everything including the "flea market" economy)... If the Russian equivalent of Sceptical Enquirer comes out I doubt it's going to cover every American scandal.

American scientists have no "bee in their bonnet" about Russia from the Cold War. They merely have reason to doubt science coming out of Russia due to many many decades of a lack of science, free inquiry, and peer-reviewed reporting. The article in question, which you aparently didn't read, isn't about "bunkum in Russia," it's about the systematic failure of real science to overtake myth, magic, and pseudoscience in Russia. Granted, during the Cold War, there was some major scientific malpractice going on called "Lysenkoism."

Martin Garnder's 1957 book "Fads and Fallacies in the Name of Science" has a chapter on the breakdown of Russian science (Lysenko's scientific opponents were "vanished") and the SI article I cited merely follows the continuing failure of Russian society to embrace science and technology over myth and magic.

You seem to think that Western scientists are unwilling to look at the great advances that Russia has made in science, but the plain fact is that the "real" Russian scientists are being held back by their society.

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'Lester
The Red and the Green Stamps


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Carl Sagan? --- "Billy-uns & billy-uns ...."

Remembering how, in BOTH Communist & Csarist Eras, it seemed that RUSSIAN engineers had to produce the "Biggest & Most Powerful" engines for all purposes -- (and get them out first) ...

Don't you think it would be REAL INTERESTING to get a Brit & a Russian together, in the same bar, & just SEE how they settle things out ...

(Sorta' like B.C. drivers & Quebecois drivers -- each always INSISTING the other province produces the worst drivers ... (But, at least it starts a conversation))

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Dark Jaguar
We Wish You a Merry Giftmas


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Heh, reminds me of a whole lot of stuff, from Cthulu to Babelon to the kingdom of Zeal (that last one from Chrono Trigger).

Deep in those ancient caverns, a great city was lost...long before we Humans...long, long before...The proud city of Ehn'gha - decadent and trusting...and it was their downfall...When the Darkness came...and the Guardians slaughtered them...Their existence was but a dying echo, shrieking from violated mouths...Resounding within their homes...their tombs...If you stand alone, in one of those halls, quietly...ever so quietly...you can hear the cries of the people of Ehn'gha...rent apart by the unseen claws of the Guardians...Their echoes still linger...as do their souls...

On another note, I'm not crazy!

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Pogue Ma-humbug
Happy Christmas (Malls are Open)


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quote:
Originally posted by Animal or god?:
CAUTION.This story comes from Pravda (the Russian word for 'of dubious veracity').

Are you being facetious here? Why would a newspaper be given that name?

I always thought the word meant "truth."

Or I am just missing an obvious joke?

Pogue "yes, it is off-topic" Mahone

--------------------
Let's drink to the causes in your life:
Your family, your friends, the union, your wife.

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odaiwai-eh
The Red and the Green Stamps


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quote:
Originally posted by Pogue Mahone:
quote:
Originally posted by Animal or god?:
CAUTION.This story comes from Pravda (the Russian word for 'of dubious veracity').

Are you being facetious here? Why would a newspaper be given that name?

I always thought the word meant "truth."

Or I am just missing an obvious joke?

Pogue "yes, it is off-topic" Mahone

Pravda means 'Truth'. (Isvestia means 'News'.) The old joke was that 'There was no News in the Truth, and no Truth in the News'.

dave "and Nikolai Ivanovich Lobache-"

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